Monday, March 31, 2008

Su 25 Frogfoot - The Flying Tank

The Sukhoi su25 Frogfoot remains the mainstay of Russian ground attack regiment (shturmovoy). Su25 goes parallel to the A10 Thunderbolt, and has been matured to be a sophisticated war plane with more than 10 years of combat experience.

The T-10 prototype flew for the first time in 22 February 1975. When put to production it flew more than 60000 combat sorties in Afghanistan alone. With the experience gained in Afghanistan a number of modifications were done to the aircraft. The SU25 was more heavily committed to the invasion of Chechnya, the need for an All weather day and night ground attack capable aircraft with an extended range and survivability led to the SU25T which was based on the SU25UB two seat variant. This led to more modifications and the SU25TM variant also known as the SU39 was finally unveiled. The TK and the TM are available for export.

The Russian Air force is currently operating around 250SU25's and are constantly upgrading them because it's their front line ground attack aircraft

The SU25 is playing a major role in the rapid deployment groups in the six military districts of the Russian federation. These units have 4 SU25TM's and 12 SU25SM's

Lipetsk Air Base is the home of the SU25. The true work horse of the Russian air force is the SU25 because of its simplicity and ease of maintenance. It is described by western pilots as the Simple sturdy fast and highly maneuverable fighter they ever have flown. The SU25 is considered to be the Russian fighter pilots plane of choice. The American F18 pilots fell in love with this plane when the blue angels came to Russia and had the chance to fly the SU25. when the Russians and Americans flew MiG29's and SU27 they were really happy to see these amazing aircrafts. But none of them flew the SU25 because of the looks, most of them looked suspiciously they didn't want to fly it

Then one US pilot was pushed to fly one. And after that the American pilots were staying in line to fly the SU24

Jeffrey Ethell (late blue angels pilot) one of the first western pilots who flew the SU25 says " I've flown it, and I was very impressed with it, I was the first western pilot to fly the airplane the reason was nobody else wanted to fly it, they all said that it's a SU25its like an old A10, who wants to fly that? The SU25 is their idea of the A10, it has a 30mm gun, it fires a big round and it will punch a hole in a tank. it'll carry a lot of weapons in its side, Bombs, rockets. And what's interesting about the SU25 is once you punch everything off of it, it will go over Mach one! The A10 doest even come close. It slows down and stops right around the 400 knots. Where as the su25 will go straight to speed of sound, it will turn on a dime with great acceleration"

"We found out quickly that we need that kind of "In the face knife fighting" type of airplane, which will support the guy in the ground quickly easily and close. You got to be close to support somebody you don't stand off around 20 miles and support the guys on the front line. You got to get there with a gun and some skill, and learn how to mix it up. That's what the SU27 does. And that's why Russian air force is not getting rid of it as long as they have money. It's a simple airplane it has 2 MiG 21 engines in it reliable, been there for a long time, you can belly land this and again bring it back with simple repairs, it is a rugged airplane."

I have to emphasize some of the facts Jeffrey Ethell said about the SU25. One is, it is a close support capable aircraft with a titanium strong box cockpit it can take a barrage of 20mm gun rounds shot in close range and it barely even scratch the aircraft. Pilot and plane often escape unscathed.

One thing most people don't know is the fact that close support really means close support. I agree with Jeffrey, with my personal experience. You cannot support ground troops from miles away.

Less maintenance is a main point in fighters like this. And This aircraft can operate on any weather.

In Afghan war, Chinese made heavy anti aircraft guns, and held soviet made missiles, highly mobile stingers were used to counter the threat of the SU25 but out of that only one worked properly, it's the stinger. When the stinger was introduced the Russians had no answer to it. It managed to destroy Mi24, Mi18 and all slow and low flying objects. Later modifications of the SU25, was to fit the fighter with Flairs for heat seeking missile protection.

Spec: SU25SMT (Su39)

Type: All weather Anti Armour/Close Support Aircraft

Armament:

One 30mm NNPU 8M Cannon – with 200 Rounds

Maximum Ordnance load 5000Kg's

primary weapons Vikhr M ATGMs.

Other weapons: TV-Guided Kh-29LASMs, Kh35AShM, Kh58U and KH-31ARMs, KAB-500Kr, LGBs, KMGU – 2Submunition Dispensers, 250Kg and 500Kg RBK Series Cluster Bombs, and 50 – to 500Kg FAB Series GP Bombs plus R-27R, R-77 and R-73AAMs

Power Plant: Two MNPK Soyuz/Gavrilov R195Sh Turbojets. Each with 44.13kN

Max speed: 950Km/h

Maximum Initial climb Rate: 3480m per minute

Service Ceiling 10 000m

Combat Radius 400Km

Maximum Take-off weight 20 000Kg


45 comments:

Rover said...

Damn! Why didn't we get these?

Rover said...

Def. Wire,

How much is this baby?

hemantha said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
hemantha said...

Rover,
It's around US $ 10 million. We can buy 4 Mig-27s with that money. (My two cents.)

RomeoAlphaFoxtrot said...

From the Mig-29 thread, DefenceWire thanks for your views on the Mig29 purchase by SLAF. I too agree this would be a white elephant for the SLAF and the money is worth spending somewhere else like HUMINT.

I think the K-8s and the F-7s can do very well in the interceptor roles against the Zlins. Why the Mig-29 then ? Nways I think the deal will go through and SLAF is going to get the Mig-29.

When and if they do get I hope the authorities make maximum use of it and we get the return for the huge investment spent on it.

I must confess the Mig-29 will look good on the SLAF :) Yeah so will the F-16s and the F-15s :)

Suresh said...

Tiger Bagman charged under Canada's terrorism financing law
Prapa Thambithurai, a 45-year-old satellite dish installer who emigrated from Sri Lanka two decades ago and now living in a suburban duplex north of Toronto, is alleged to be a bagman for the Tigers.

Two weeks ago, Thambithurai became the first person charged under Canada's terrorism financing law, which makes it a crime to collect money knowing it "will be used by or will benefit a terrorist group."

Part of the Anti-Terrorism Act brought in after 9/11, the law has been on the books for more than six years, but nobody had ever been charged until Thambithurai's car was pulled over in New Westminster, B.C. on March 14 night.

Police seized more than $1,000 in cash as well as pledge forms, Thambithurai told the National Post in his first public comments since his arrest.

The Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) alleges he was soliciting for the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam, (LTTE), which is on Canada's list of outlawed terrorist groups.

Thambithurai was active in the Vancouver chapter of the World Tamil Movement (WTM), which came under police investigation in 2003 as an alleged Tiger front organisation.

RCMP Corporal Paul Huston visited the WTM office in Vancouver in 2004 and described what he saw in a search warrant application: "Inside the office, behind the counter was a large picture of Velupillai Prabhakaran, the leader of the LTTE, with the logo of the WTM on the picture, a large flag of the LTTE was positioned by the front door beside the flag of British Columbia; inside a glass cabinet were LTTE compact discs and flags for sale; on a bookshelf beside the glass cabinet were videos and books for sale or rent; behind the front counter were WTM newspapers for sale."

Since moving to Ontario four years ago, Thambithurai has kept a low profile. He runs a company called Solar Satellite Service and has three children. He said he was not active in the Ontario branch of the WTM, which is also under police investigation.

But when he returned to B.C. earlier this month and began collecting money, police moved quickly. The RCMP said in a press release he was "targeting residents of the Lower Mainland of Tamil heritage to make cash donations to support the LTTE."

The case is a first for Canada but it follows a series of similar arrests in Europe and the United States that have taken down key figures in what is sometimes called Tigers Inc., the global financial network that sends money and arms to the Tigers.

"It is estimated that 95 per cent of the LTTE's operational revenue is generated outside Sri Lanka," says a declassified report by Canada's Integrated Threat Assessment Centre.

The World Tamil Movement is an important part of that financial pipeline, the RCMP says. Members of the group collect "war taxes" from ethnic Tamils in Canada and send the money to the Tigers, police said.

While some give voluntarily, others feel pressured to donate. Tigers, supporters will visit a family up to three times a week seeking cash.

"Fundraisers may refuse to leave the house without a pledge of money, and have told individuals who claim not to have funds available to borrow the money, to place contributions on their credit cards, or even to re-mortgage their homes," Human Rights Watch wrote in a 2006 report.

The cash seized from Thambithurai's car is but a fraction of the $209-million that Canada's anti-money laundering agency, FINTRAC, says passed through Canadian financial institutions last year despite suspected links to terrorist activity and other security threats.

Given the amount of terrorist-related money said to be moving through Canada to support violent causes from Lebanon to Afghanistan, to some of the most surprising part about the arrest is why it took so long.

The RCMP first raided the WTM's Canadian headquarters in Scarborough, Ont., in 2006. Police have been pouring over the seized evidence for almost two years now.

A judge has given police until the middle of next month to either return the materials or press charges.

Thambithuri faces a possible 10-year jail term if convicted but insisted the money he collected was "100 per cent" for humanitarian relief and had nothing to do with terrorism.

Tigers in Canada

October 18, 1995: Manickavasagam Suresh, then the co-ordinator of the World Tamil Movement, is arrested for allegedly raising money for the Tigers. Immigration officials have been trying to deport him ever since but he has remained in Canada by launching repeated court appeals.

September. 16, 1998 RCMP officers arrest Muralitharan Nadarajah, alleging he is a former leader of the Swiss branch of the Tigers and had entered Canada on a false passport.

November 24, 2005 RCMP search the Vancouver office of the World Tamil Movement (WTM).

March 15, 2006 Human Rights Watch reports the Tigers are using extortion tactics to raise money in Toronto.

April 10, 2006 The Canadian government announces the Tamil Tigers have been placed on Ottawa's list of designated terrorist entities. April 12, 2006 RCMP search the WTM's Montreal office.

April 22, 2006 RCMP search the Toronto WTM office and seize a moving truck full of materials. Police later claim they found manuals on missile guidance systems, books encouraging suicide bombings, an Elections Canada voter list and evidence of terrorist fundraising. No charges have been laid.

August 21, 2006 Following a joint FBI-RCMP investigation, Project O-Needle, seven Canadians are charged for allegedly trying to buy weapons for the LTTE.

November 15, 2007 The US Treasury freezes the assets of the Tamil Rehabilitation Organization office in Toronto, alleging it is part of a worldwide network that covertly supports the Tigers.

March 14, 2008 Prapa Thambithurai is arrested in New Westminster, B.C., and becomes the first person charged under Canada's terrorist financing law. National Post, Canada)

The Law on Financing Terrorism

Providing, making available, etc., property or services for terrorist purposes.

Criminal Code SECTION 83.03

Everyone who, directly or indirectly, collects property, provides or invites a person to provide, or makes available property or financial or other related services:

(a) intending that they be used, or knowing that they will be used, in whole or in part, for the purpose of facilitating or carrying out any terrorist activity, or for the purpose of benefiting any person who is facilitating or carrying out such an activity, or

(b) knowing that, in whole or part, they will be used by or will benefit a terrorist group, is guilty of an indictable offence and is liable to imprisonment for a term of not more than 10 years.

Courtesy : Daily News

Moshe Dyan said...

OK Tomcat so you came up with a striking analysis of Su-25.

i'm convinced that su-25 is the CAS plane of russia. A-10 is the best in the world and since we cannot get hold of that Su-25 is the next best.

in fact russia retired its MiG-27 fleet beacause the sukhoi company beat the gurevich company in coming up with the best CAS plane.

and the su-25 is still operational and MiG-27 is not (in russia).

In Soviet war in afghanistan MiG-23/27s were also used and MiG-27 suffered NO casualties!!! Of course much less flying hours than Su-25.

BUT there is nothing wrong with our MiG-27s. If we can buy 3 MiG-27s from US$ 11 million, we must go for the MiG-27 without any contest.

when MiG-29 and Su-25 is compared......
Su-25 is much more relevant than MiG-29. it is $4 million less, easy to service, higher CAS, more reliable in operational life, higher air-to-ground payload.

I found the answer why i didn't like it - the same reason some pilots didn't like it!!!! looks can certainly be deceiving.

BTW someone by the handle "senkavi" suggested this here or in DN some time ago.

shay said...

Tomcat,

Ok. Its seems to be a lot faster than I was previously led to believe, so probably would be a good addition to the SLAF, if we could afford dedicated CAS aircraft in addition to multi-role aircraft. I wouldn't trust the Russian flares they have put in against the newer MANPAD's, but you can probably get a better self-protection package from the Israeli's or somewhere else.

However, the problem with CAS in the SL context is not the aircraft. Its the lack of all the other requirements, namely co-ordination with the SLA, need to keep a'craft in the air almost all the time etc. SL is not Afghanistan and the jungle terrain where much of the fighting is going on (Weli-Oya, parts of Mannar) means its would be much harder for pilots to find LTTE targets in close quarter fighting without excellent co-ordination with SLA. There is a very good post by Eksath on CAS on the LNP Kfir thread. I put the link of the previous thread about Mig29.

Given the difference in price, more Mig-27's would also be a good option. They can carry most of the weapons you mentioned and only slightly less payload (but then you can buy 4 for the price of one). The only problem with more Mig-27's is that these airframes are now getting old and they don;t seem to have any newer variants/airframes unlike the newer versions of the Su-25.

Sivarassaiah said...

so now where did you copy paste this from mr tomcat?

TomCat said...

Yes, we can settle with MiG27's and stay with MiG27's for a very long time. Given that we don't intend to fight with our Neighbors any time soon, well to tell you the truth the only Neighbor we can fight is Maldives and I don't think they will put up much of a fight.

But what difference will it make, us talking about wasting our money? I'm never against the MiG27's its I think the best we can get when you think about the price. But as we all know SLAF and SLGOV really doesn't care about the price of the aircraft or how relevant it is to our conflict.

As with all the deals its about how much money they can make with commissions.

But the SLAF/SLGOV will give nice reasons like the MiG27 is an old fighter and not being in production and being replaced by other fighters (without mentioning the Su25).

We don't intend to fight a war with the LTTE for the rest of our life and the lifespan of the MiG27 is more than enough. We can use them for another 10 – 20 years without any issues. And buy more if we want.

The reason why I posted the Su25 article is to tell everyone that we don't have to buy an sophisticated high maintenance high cost air superiority fighter when we can get a dedicated ground attack air craft which is cheaper to buy and maintain.

The SLAF/SLGOV already knows about the MiG27 and its performance, but they ignore the fact that it is the best alternative we have. So they were going for a (so called) better fighter, my duty is to show the issues we will face with the MiG29, and to provide an alternative (something that they cannot complain).

Its not about the MiG27, its about SLAF MiG29. From my knowledge we really don't have a need to have better jet fighters. What we have is enough. Our battle ground is less than 65610 square Km's and why do we need all these to fight a 15000 strong terrorist group thats trapped In the north of our small country?

I think we all know the answer......

with all that in our minds we must give credit to SLAF/SLGOV for doing a superb job in fighting terrorism..!

koombiya said...

I have been reading this blog for sometime now and though I should join in, just for my satisfaction.

Becouse I don't think no matter what we do here will not effect the outcome(hopefully SL will win the fight with LTTE terrorists, if we dont get another "Parippu drop" incident from International Cr*pers)

koombiya said...

All Su-25s in Russia are grounded while the military investigates the cause of Thursday's explosion.

http://www.startribune.com/world/16847366.html

Illegal.existence said...

I don't see the logic in comparing the cost of brand new Su-25s vs. used MiG-27s. If we were to purchase CAS aircraft, I doubt we'll be paying $8-10 million for a 35 year old aircraft. According to Jane's, Congo bought 10 Su-25s for $5 million total (that's $500,000 a piece) from Georgia in Nov '99. I don't know what condition they were in, but some of them are still operational.

Anyways, given the very limited use of the Mi-24s we have, I'd be surprised if the government pushes through a deal for CAS aircraft anytime soon.

LKDOOD said...

Sri Lankan war jets bomb LTTE airstrip

LINK

LKDOOD said...

who is tomcat ?

LKDOOD said...

Sri Lanka offering overseas jobs to Tamil rebels

LINK

LKDOOD said...

Illegal travel to India lands Sri Lankans in trouble

LINK

LKDOOD said...

21 killed in Lanka clashes, LTTE runway damaged

LINK

LKDOOD said...

I committed 'three' mistakes as Lanka prez: Kumaratunga

LINK

TropicalStorm said...

-Too much drinking
-Always late for everything
-Couldn't keep pussy covered

Rajarata said...

I've Always said we should have gotten 3 Su 25's from Hungary ! Since we have accuired the Mig 29's !

Moshe Dyan said...

"Its not about the MiG27, its about SLAF MiG29. From my knowledge we really don't have a need to have better jet fighters. What we have is enough. "

totally agree with you tomcat and thanks for the very valuable atricles/comments.

Moshe Dyan said...

tomcat,

i posed this question before and defencewire answered in the negative.

can the LTTE have a MiG-21 as some reports suggested about a year ago?

1. yesterday SLAF has TWICE bombed a NEW tiger airstrip which is just 10km from Mulaitivu. all 3 other likely airstrips were close to Iranamadu, etc.

2. F-7s are as good as MiG-21s and cannot necessarily overpower them.

3. SLAF is buying a world class interceptor with the highest price SL ever paid for an equipment

4. SLAF head - roshan goonatilake always harps on the requirement of MiG-29s

is there anything BIG that we MAY not know?

(to this defencewire actually answered "yes")

Long-Ranger said...

Moshe Dyan,

Like I said to a pro-Tami Tiger member earlier

If the Tamil Tigers were only interested in making the Zling 143s to land at the Iranamadu airstrip it does not need to be a tarmac with centreline and threshold markings. Meaning it was prepared for much larger aircraft with much larger endurance in mind. I believe your little organisation is resourceful. It would not spend such resources and time on a white elephant.

Another pointer to note, the arrest of Victor Bout, even though not deemed 'significant' with regards to Sri Lanka according to the media, I hear otherwise.

P.S: I am in the process of releasing my next brief. Stay tuned.

Take Care.

Long-Ranger said...

Some interesting exerpts from the Charge list compiled by the US Department of Justice

"At that time, BOUT requested
SMULIAN and CS-1 to fly from Bulgaria over Chechnya, and to air
drop crates and boxes over Chechnya. While never explicitly told what was inside the crates, CS-1 understood that the crates contained arms shipments."

"On or about January 28, 2008, at the direction of the DEA, CS-1 and CS-2 met with ANDREW SMULIAN, the defendant, in Bucharest again. During the meeting, which was recorded, SMULIAN provided CS-2 with a digital memory stick, which is an electronic device used to store digital information, that contained the following:
1 an article about VIKTOR BOUT, a/k/a "Boris," a/k/a "Victor Anatoliyevich Bout," a/k/a "Victor But," a/k/a "Viktor Budd," a/k/a "Viktor Butt," a/k/a "Viktor Bulakin," a/k/a "Vadim Markovich Aminov," the defendant, which includes a photograph of BOUT; and

2 documents containing photographs and specifications for the Igla surface-to-air missiles and armor piercing rocket launchers that SMULIAN had previously said BOUT could provide."

For the interested the full document can be found:

http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/pr/2008/March/
bout-complaint.pdf

A pretty interesting read. :-)

Moshe Dyan said...

fantastic long-ranger.

i'm a fan of your blog as well.

good work mate; keep it up.

TropicalStorm said...

Moshe

Don't fall for the LTTE's psy-ops.

They always inflate their capabilities and come up with a low cost solution which always amazes everyone. That's good strategy, but doesn't necessarily last very long once exposed. Two cases in point are the zlins, after much hype, and the recent naval mine strike. There also was another 'chemical/nerve gas attack' which turned out to be a crude form of tear gas and blew back in their own faces.
Got to admit, they are good at it.

Sun Tzu's disciple said...

I agree with many posters that the Mig29 is an overkill for the present conflict scenario.A good discussion on a Mig Vs Sukhoi airwar in http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_189.shtml

and
http://ethiopundit.blogspot.com/2005/05/rise-and-fall-of-eaf.html


Ethiopia vs Eritrea is perhaps an appropriate comparison to SL vs LTTE in terms of size, population and resource difference .In the Air-War cited above, the Ethiopian Su-27s seems to have outperformed and defeated the 'superior' Mig-29s of Eritrean air force every time, blowing them out of the sky.Of course there are other factors too--like training & maintenance.

*****
On an unrelated note, GoSL runs the risk of turning into a pariah state if it continues officially sanctioning/covering genocidal activities.One must remember that Kosovo was born mainly out of Human Rights abuses by the Serbians--and the Serbs had Russia to back it up did not save it in the end.
[By Peter Apps

LONDON, April 1 (Reuters) - A rights group report on Tuesday blamed local security forces for the massacre of 17 Sri Lankan tsunami aid workers in 2006 and accused the government of an outright cover-up.
"It does more than name the names of those responsible for the brutal ACF killings," said Human Rights Watch senior legal adviser James Ross. "It shows the government investigations into the massacre were little more than a bad joke played out on the victims' families and the international community."]

Moshe Dyan said...

TS,

agree. LTTE is very good at that. even those crapies who post LTTE stuff in DN and DW are part of it.

but mate my 4 points and 2 points made by LR are based on logic and do not rely on LTTE propoganda.

something doesn't add up.

i don't wish to create rumours; only after some info. to prove that my concerns are wrong.

the mere fact that LTTE had constructed a new runway means ALOT. this is a MASSIVE threat.
we should go after their goodies hidden somewhere.

if the maggots manage to do another KIA run.........

one main task of an air force is to completely finish-off the air force of the enemy ASAP. it is not air superiority that matter in a war; complete dominance is what matters

Ogre said...

I initially called for this air craft to be included in our list of ground attack planes for sri lanka air force

actually SU25 have better accuracy than Mig27's

the only problem was that few of these were shot down using MANIPADS during the afgan war.

all the attacks against it took place under 10,000 feet.

this plane is ideal for Sri lanka's close air support because it is a souped out A10 with better capacity, handling is awesome.


she may look ugly but she rides and handles smooth and nice.

once you go Su25 you wont go back !

Ogre said...

for further information:

Flag of Peru Peru
Peru received eighteen Su-25s in late 1998 from Belarus, which refurbished them prior to delivery. The shipment comprised ten single-seat and eight dual-seat Su-25UB trainers. The aircraft were all built just before the collapse of the Soviet Union and thus represented the final versions of the Soviet Su-25. It is believed that between 1998 and December 2005, at least twenty-five light aircraft transporting cocaine had been shot down by the Peruvian Su-25s.

Ogre said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4CLqwLxroQ&feature=related

Ogre said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVJNOuazsZ0&feature=related

CASC said...

Where ever there is conflict there are human right violations (Columbia, Iraq, Afghanistan). Unlike terrorist organizations that use terror as an integral part of their policy, democratic governments like Sri Lanka do not use terror as an official policy. Occasionally people who work for democratic governments commit human rights violations but that is the exception not the norm, and it does not reflect government policy. Japan, China and India are Sri lanka's three largest bi-lateral donors in size, and I believe the ADB (which is under Japanese control) is the largest multilateral donor. It is very likely that within the next 5 years India will become Sri lanka's largest trading partner.
Under these circumstances, it is immaterial what the rest of the world thinks sbout so called human rights in Sri Lanka.

Sun Tzu's disciple said...

casc,
"Where ever there is conflict there are human right violations "
Very True.



"Sri Lanka do not use terror as an official policy."

What is 'official policy'? Even the 'terrorist'orgs dont not declare 'terror'as official ploicy.
But what about these?

1.Complicit in Crime
State Collusion in Abductions and Child Recruitment by the Karuna Group:HRW report(http://www.hrw.org/reports/2007/srilanka0107/)

2.
Sri Lanka: Government Abuses Intensify
Killings, Abductions and Displacement Soar as Impunity Reigns :HRW [Excerpt]The Sri Lankan government has apparently given its security forces a green light to use ‘dirty war’ tactics,” said Brad Adams, Asia director at Human Rights Watch.
[excerpt](http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2007/08/03/slanka16573.htm)

"Under these circumstances, it is immaterial what the rest of the world thinks sbout so called human rights in Sri Lanka."

Sad way to think. Today ,as far as Regime change/Neo-independence etc is concerned, International Community for all practical purposes means US + EU + AnZac .So Sri Lankas new friends Iran, Russia or China may only delay the inevitable backlash from IC ,if GoSL continues its Human Rights abuses.To remind again, Serbia could not save itself from giving rise to Croatia, Bosnia, Kosovo and Montenegro inspite of being under Russian tutelage.

Sun Tzu's disciple said...

casc,

It is alright to seek to defeat the enemy.But it is not alright to execute hundreds of your own citizens on mere suspicion using 'death squads'(for want of a better name).If you feel justified in executing them this way, these people also can justify not wanting to be part of such a nation.
[Recurring Nightmare
State Responsibility for “Disappearances” and Abductions in Sri Lanka :HRW(http://hrw.org/reports/2008/srilanka0308/)]

Parkyanadan said...

Please compare SU25 and MIg 29, Accuracy and Speed

http://www.enemyforces.com/aircraft/mig29.htm
http://www.enemyforces.com/aircraft/su25.htm

We should have more accurate and more protective Air craft, Ex. Kafeer and F7G

is very suitable for Sri Lanka,

When we compare SU 25 and MIG 29, MIG 29 is more Speedy and more accurate air

craft. So We better go for MIG 29. Its easy to handle and Accurate Ground target

as well as air to air attacks,

Seepd MIG 29 = 1'500/2'400 Km/h
SU 25 = 950 km/h

So no drought MIG29 is best option

Suresh said...

Unconfirmed reports say we got madhu (Church area)-
Awaiting Confirmation

LKDOOD said...

Prabhakaran met suicide squad before Lankan vessel was sunk

LINK

Lanka says no move to postpone Provincial Council polls

LINK

Illegal.existence said...

'Unconfirmed reports say we got madhu (Church area)-
Awaiting Confirmation"

I wouldn't be surprised if something big has happened suresh. There's an article on army.lk

"THREE LTTE fired mortar bombs fell into the holy Madhu shrine premises on Tuesday (01) twice. Those three mortar strikes have fallen towards residential quarters of the clergy in the shrine. But reports so far received do not speak of any damages or any casualties according to reports."

They wouldn't be firing mortar's at areas under their full control.

lamak said...

std,

all your reports are from hrw - didnt you for a moment think that this could be an organization with vested interests in our conflict? that since working on human rights is the fuel that runs their organization, they would exaggerate any claims of HR violations?

'It is alright to seek to defeat the enemy.But it is not alright to execute hundreds of your own citizens on mere suspicion using 'death squads'(for want of a better name)'

dude, once again, im laughing at you cos the only information you bother to read if by some foreign agency with vested interests. Atleast read the local newspapers regularly if u decide to comment on our issues k? where the hell did u read about hundreds of citizens being executed by death squads? Since you are following such an academic stance in all your posts, could you please give me a link reporting hundreds of citizens being abducted and murdered? surely that would be sensational news if true.

u keep popping up and putting such false info, so lets clear this out. First off, there was a period in 2006/2007 when there was abductions occuring - maybe the gov was involved since it happened in our areas. But know that it was nowhere of this magnitude - the propaganda by the LTTE groups and rights groups merely magnified this issue. Anyway, the rajapakse gov (or whoever backed this group) knew it was getting them into deep waters judjing by the international furore it caused. They soon backed off - its rare that we hear of any abductions now - if at all and mentioning armed abductions has merely become the LTTE's new ploy of justifying or signalling a new attack on SL civilians.
for the record, I believe that the abductions spate last year (Whatever the motive was) was a stupid move on the part of the government, and that those involved should be named and sentenced, so we can move on from that past issue.

The image you are having is of shite death squads in iraq, continously and summarily executing civilians by the hundreds - again the pathetic vision of a gullible ill informed foreigner i should say.

'To remind again, Serbia could not save itself from giving rise to Croatia, Bosnia, Kosovo and Montenegro inspite of being under Russian tutelage.'

ummm dude, serbia being under the russian tutelage is exactly what caused it to be split up - the americans (though nato) simply used them to score another win against the communists, and thus threw their military weight behind the split.

sri lanka, on the other hand, holds no such importance for the western powers to actively cause a division. Reports and warnings do nothing to hurt our country unless backed by action. I'd rather Sri Lanka be branded a pariah or whatever by ill informed western coutries and live free of terror at home, rather than be a model kid for the rest of the world yet live in fear in our own home country.

Sun Tzu's disciple said...

lamak,

"all your reports are from hrw "

Dont be naive. Do you want be to waste space by also pasting reports from SLMM/UN/ICRC/Amnesty/AHRC/IIGEP/CPA/UTJHR etc to make basically the same point?

"this could be an organization with vested interests in our conflict"

Unless all of above are 'vested'interests.

"Atleast read the local newspapers regularly if u decide to comment on our issues k"

Indeed I do--atleast majority of English ones on net I do, and have been doing so for quite sometime(years).For e.g. many of your local papers carried a report yesterday in which UTJHR has clearly and unambiguosly named the GoSL for massacring 17 Aid Workers, and also covering it up.

"The image you are having is of shite death squads in iraq
"
Its ur own imagination. But UN reports have indeed identified SL as one of the most worst in the world for civilian disappearances(read murder) and also media death/intimidation.If you consider that there are scores of tinpot countries in Africa/Latin america/Asia then the label 'one of the worst'is indeed a horrible one. It is upto Sri Lankans to decide if you want to continue to keep company of Sudan/NK/Iran/Zimbabwe/Burma and such..

"americans (though nato) simply used them to score another win against the communists"

I did not know that Russia & Serbia were communists:)


"Reports and warnings do nothing to hurt our country unless backed by action"
This EXACTLY is the problem--Sri Lankans not caring about brutality to own citizens as long as someone dont actually take action against you. Remember the LTTE-supporters must have been making similar rationale till the IC hammer brought them their present condition. Do not think SL is a special state(I often see this rhetoric here)--LTTE can easily gain upper hand if EU/US/Nato simply withdraw trade concessions to SL and impose an arms embargo.It is in SLs interest not to provoke such an action.

Suresh said...

Sri Lanka Air Force targets secret rendezvous place of LTTE leaders
Wednesday, April 2, 2008, 11:43 GMT, ColomboPage News Desk, Sri Lanka.

Apr 02, Colombo: Sri Lanka Air Force fighter jets raided a secret rendezvous place of LTTE leaders located west of Visvamdhu tank in Kilinochchi, this morning.

According to Air Force sources, the fighter pilots have confirmed the target was accurately hit. However, they said that it is too early to assess the damage to the Tigers by the raid.

Meanwhile, defence intelligence sources said that the target is of high value, as its whereabouts was only known to those in the inner circles of the LTTE chief. The sources said that the target consists of a rendezvous place and a secret passage frequently used by the LTTE leaders including Prabhakaran himself.

TropicalStorm said...

For those of you who are concerned abt the lack of speedy progress towards Killi'chi;

the idea is to destroy the fighting formations the LTTE has built up, and softening it all up before inducting troops into the area. There are many reasons for this; prevent ground consolidation troops falling to hit and run attacks, prevent logistics problems as the area of control enlarges etc. Fighting away from civillian areas also limits collateral damage and allows for evacuation of civillians to safety prior to taking over territory.

Give it a little time...and enjoy the ride.

TropicalStorm said...

when re-publishing another's article, it is not only a common courtesy to give credit to the author, it is also a legal requirement.

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