Some of you have been asking us some questions with regard to India and the acquisition of new weapons. We hope to provide you with some answers. Please note that information deemed highly sensitive by us have been omitted.
India and Tamil Nadu
According to our sources, which are primarily from the defence sector, Indian Central Government has instructed the government of Sri Lanka to achieve its targeted objectives before the 15th Lok Sabha Elections in India next year. The elections will be held in April-May 2009.
The Sri Lankan government and its armed forces are preparing to reach a decisive stage in the war by that time. Its objective would be to capture Kilinochchi and Pooneryn and corner the Tigers into Mullaitivu. Once this threshold is reached, the ruling party in India would engage Tamil Nadu politics and openly issue warnings to Sri Lanka to increase safeguards for Tamil minority rights. The Sri Lanka government will then oblige.
Currently, if you observe Indian politics, Jayalalitha Jeyaram and her counterparts have only issued isolated statements on the issue and have not adopted an anti Sri Lanka government stance as a sustained policy. She even boycotted a large demonstration organized by the Communist Party recently.
The ruling part in India and Jayalalitha Jeyaram will become vociferous as the election draws near to attract Tamil votes, especially if the Tamil question in Sri Lanka becomes a powerful issue in Tamil Nadu. But the Indian government will maintain its non-interventionist policy in Sri Lanka. It is also apprehensive of Sri Lanka's growing alliance with Pakistan and China.
In fact, a Sri Lankan military delegation returned from Pakistan with a load of weapons for the war barely two weeks ago. Pakistan and China, the other two nuclear superpowers in the region, define the LTTE as a terrorist organization. Pakistan is urging Sri Lanka to become the first state in the region and perhaps even in the world to crush terrorism since that country is also facing a terrorist problem.
New Arms: MIG 29s
NO MIG-29S HAVE BEEN BOUGHT BY SRI LANKA. The bill was too expensive, in the range of $500 million, which is too much for the economy. In any case, the F-7s have demonstrated adequate air superiority and the Kfirs and Mig-27s have done more than their share in reducing LTTE infrastructure to rubble. If any investment is to be made, it will be made on servicing and further improving the aircrafts we already have, including the workhorse of the military-- the MI24/35.
Sri Lankan Ex-Military as Mercenaries
Please await a detailed analysis on the issue in the coming weeks.
Thank you,
DW Team
Sunday, October 12, 2008
Q&A with DefenceWire
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140 comments:
I have no knowladge of politics, however Thank you DefenceWire for the articale
DefenceWire,
"The Sri Lanka government will then oblige."
If permissible, can you please elaborate the ways we want to oblige?
sam,
The Indians will call on the government to safeguard Tamils. This is where the SL government will oblige and is currently obliging. This is how we see the government doing this.
1. define terrorist and tamil rights separately. These are two different things.
2. deal with tamil aspirations while dealing with LTTE
3. define LTTE as a terrorist movement supported by LTTE's own recent activities (i.e. suicide bombings)
4. Tie the government response to this terrorism with the western concept of 'war on terror'.
5. strengthen this new understanding regionally and globally
6. pro actively support tamils entering democratic mainstream, whatever their past maybe (i.e. Karuna, Pillayan)
7. start development work, relief, rehab, reconstruction etc (i.e. eastern province)
8. maintain APRC as a backup for a national policy on the political question
No Mig29s???? Well quite a surprise...I saw a number of comments that even claimed that they saw the birds... :-o
So with the saving if $500 Miilion...have we invested/planning to invest on any new systems??
I said # of months ago that 700 year old capitalism will see its end in few decades, but I haven't thought that it will start that quickly. Everyone thought that former US fed chairman, Alan Greenspan, is one of a kind genius. In fact he is one of the main culprits of current crisis by favoring the deregulation of derivative market in Wall street. He whines now that problems is not with the deregulation of derivative markets in Wall Street, it's with the people who used the derivative market got greedy- in his words gun did not kill the person, but whoever operated the gun killed the person. Well, if you issue the guns in the ghetto street, what will happen? WS bankers were already greedy ones before the gun which is derivative market issued to them, and they maxed it out in their favor. Thanks Greenspan for your legacy.
Thanks DW..
Interesting piece of info about the Mig 29s. I was suprized to hear it though. According to what i heard previously, I thought the birds will be here in November.
Anyway its a good decision as it's a too much burden on economy. I think we can still pull things off with what we already have. [Ya..F-7s proved sufficient for TAF menace and SLAF always had a good time with Mig 27s,Kfirs & Mi-25/35s :) ]
Tamil Democratic National Alliance says that Tamilnadu shud put more and more pressure on LTTE.
http://defence.lk/new.asp?fname=20081012_01
And I like to know what pussycat supporters have gotta say about this.
It looks like more of a tamil-tamil affair now, which it really is. We the state of SL reacting in the essential and inevitable way whereas the Tamilnadu affair is left with different factions of Tamils.
I have a bit of sympathy on pussycats being in the receiving end of this. Pussycats are a symptom - the big cancer of diaspora is hiding under their shadow. In the elementary level the conflict is between the migrant tamils and those who live in SL, whose life is taken over to military slavery by prior group. Pussycats are the paid mercenary who does the job for the migrant tamils. I wish the SL tamils will be free oneday, as you're our own nationals and we dont want foreigners [diaspora] dictating terms on you. We as the nation SL will defend you from them at our maximum capacity.
---------------------------
There was talk about the agenda of Bhairav. I have a first hand experience of his nonsense logic. See the proceedings in point form. This is another episode of revealing cunning and stupid approach of these lads. You can realize the kind of mental defects of them out of it.
- Bhairav stated that it was tamils who brought the civilization to sinhala aborigines [I like the last word, the only truth in the statement]
-I proved him he is talking about carrying the box as a servant, that belonged to the Europeans.
- I further asked him what the diaspora did to so called great tamil civilization. Dividends of >300 years of bootlicking is lost in <30 years of stupidity.
- I dont think Bhairav has an answer. I dont think he can even make up something other than either calling me Modaya or blaming mahawamsa.
- So he just commented on a side fact which I stated "if tamils are intelligent why is taminadu lesser educated and lesser civilized?" He ignored all the rest.
- And he tells me not to consider race when you discuss intelligence, look who's talking?
- And he wont reply my rest of arguments until I accept that Tamilnadu is the most educated and civilised state of India - which is another big lie.
- I am waiting for Bhairav to stop the dirty games and face the facts for what they are. I stand by all my comments including the fact that Tamilnadu is lesser educated and lesser civilized. And I assert again that it is not a way of stating intelligence is race based, but just showing a true fact.
Conclusion:
So we are seeing the cunning pavement traders who hide behind the pile of comments when they are battered with right points.They use school-age type debate arguments in order to save their faces from eminent loss.
And they think that they are spoiling the blog here, but i think we ought to thank them for giving us this ride and also opportunity to explain the myth of theirs very well.
And personally, special thanks to Bhairav for helping my study on educated maniacs who cannot recover from a 1983 riot.
DW said: NO MIG-29S HAVE BEEN BOUGHT BY SRI LANKA.
Wonder which friendly nation wet-leased these to SLAF...
No wonder LTTE terrorists are going ape sh*t in TN.
LMSLAO
[That is OK. I accept Vellalar. However, I cannot accept Vellalar supporters of LTTE/Eelam. If you are such then please declare it.]
mailravana,
Yes, I'm vellalan, most vellalars supports Tamil cause. Regardless of what caste we Tamil are, all support the Tamil cause, they are not hell bent on Tamil Eelam but they prefer at least North and East combined federal solution.
Guys,
CollapseComments 0.0.1 is ready
Its a FireFox extension that can selectively collapse (and expand too) comments based on nicks and profile ids.
Extension is hosted at addons.mozilla.org and you can install it by visiting the following URL.
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This will allow you to automatically collapse comments by impostors and spammers.
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CollapseComments 0.0.1 is still in the sandbox, meaning its still in the experimental state.
defencewire
How can the 5 Mig-29s cost $500 million?
They cost about 15 million each. How did you get the $500 million figure?
Panhinda, OaOA,
This is the comment I promised on the root[s] and expansion Sinhala nation. Note that this is a purely academic analysis and I do not want to use this as a decision maker for today's SL matters. Nor so I mean to hurt any of our bro/sis in this land or to state anyone is greater than anyone else. [I'm not from tamil diaspora OK?]
Defence Wire, terribly sorry to use your blog as a platform for a topic out of the context of today's war against terrorism.
---------------
Roots of Sinhala nation is too deep that it is hard to find. Most of them contradict and are disputed for the same reasons. Few related facts;
- SL has evidence of humonoids for more than 100000yrs. Very recently they found that ~8000 years ago there was some settlement in Kirinda. Evidence is yet to arrive in big scale, but I'm sure that there is a big story hidden under our feat.
- Valmiky's Ramayan [later a holy book for hindu and evidence for history of tamil terrorism for great academics in the likes of Amma Gahayi] is based on a seemingly fictional story about a fight of non-aryan origin native king and Aryan origin indian king. The best analysis that I saw regarding this was; that it explains the type of conflict that existed in the fringe of Aryan civilization of India, where the pre-aryan great civilizations perished one by one. It further states that this one story of Rama-Ravana must have happened for millenia among many kings in two sides.
- Around 15000yrs ago India and SL were said to be land linked and hence it is impractical to talk about differences at that time.
- Buddhist books state about Buddha visiting SL, and also some traders of his time making a shrine here. This proves that SL and India had regular touch by then too.
- Some remarks of few tribes in SL, like Yakka, Naga, Deva etc.
- Some books think that Vijaya and 700 aryans started the Sinhala nation, but that sounds pretty unrealistic. It is not possible for 700 ppl to kill the whole population and start new. They may have ruled parts of the island, but majority shud have been whoever lived in SL.
- There are evidence, arceological and scripture based, on many aryan Indians settling in various parts of the island.
- equally evidence about tamils coming from south india in early days of Anuradhapura kingdom.
It is impossible to find one root for a nation like sinhala, as it is like a river. Although you call that the longest tributary as the root of it, the main contributor can be some other. And at the river mouth you cant say whose water is which.
With this let me have a look at the expansions of Sinhala nation.
Around 2000yrs ago, SL was quite a big nation by population wrt to other countries of its time. Economic prosperity and central location [very important in the times of sail ships] made SL a centre more like Singapore, Dubai etc of today. So many ppl came and got integrated among the main nation called Sinhala.
Can give you lots of info for this mix but here is a brief.
- There is one caste populated in either side of Galle [mostly within the district] who is said to be some descendants from an Indian brahman group which came to SL ~1000yrs ago. They talk sinhala with an accent and I found it pretty close to Hindi flow. They have written history running upto Deva Pathiraja Amathi of Parakramabahu the second. They faught against Kalinga Magha for the sinhala side. They are indeed sinhala and I hv relatives.
- Nissanka Alagakkonara who built Kotte city came from a nontamil region in south india.
- Note that most Portugese really got mixed with us and I'm sure most of us have some of their genes. From the village of my origin, some surnames carry word "thuppahi" and those are direct descendants. When you read Robert Knox's book, you'll see how deap rooted our Protugese relationship is. Those half portugese descendants are inseparably sinhala and mostly buddhist now.
- Of course there must have so much of mix in the first part of history, of which we have no records. I mean the time of Anuradhapura era. Books like Mahawamsa states endless names of migrations and new tribes.
- It is unrealistic to think that Sinhala and Tamil are totally separated. In fact there is evidence that lots of tamils lived in the anuradhapura kingdom and most of them managed well with the other races [as there was no diaspora]. I'm sure that some of them got integrated into Sinhala. It is a myth to believe that they remained completely unmixed within a great metropolitan of its time for 1000s of years. And it is very wrong to interpret them as the fore-fathers of today's nothern tamils. I am getting into it little later.
As you can see my idea is that Sinhala is a composite nation. However, there are few more ethnic groups who remained separate from it due to various reasons. One common reason is that they came in recent times and still had not enough time to be fully integrated. Let's see who they are.
- tamil influx in past millenium due to the population eruption in Tamilnadu caused a pure Tamil minority in North. Their destruction of the Sinhala kingdom and subsequent migration of sinhala to southern regions,
- Ah, there are upcountry tamils too, who were brought by british.
- Equally the Muslim dominance of pre-colonial era made many wealthy Muslims traveling to SL primarily as traders and they always left local wives [in that free-sex community] who were converted and hence there is a Muslim minority. Also there were some direct Muslim influx from a tamil speaking region. Note that Muslims are unable to mix as freely as the other two main groups due to religion. The pragmatic version of Hindu-Buddhist continum creates lesser confusion upon integration.
- The Europeans, mostly dutch, added another group. The reason for this is since in 1796 Holland was under Napoleon and when Brits captured low country of SL, many Dutch "captives" preferred to live under British than going home and live under Napoleon. They lost the link in the process and settled here.
- In recent times small groups of ppl came from Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Japan, Persia etc. These ppl live as small minorities and they are in a rapid process of integration into other main ethnic groups due to smaller numbers.
- Also many non-tamil Indian races came in past several centuries. Malayali, Waduga, Chetti etc [what is the group that Dimitri Mascarannes of England cricket team belongs to? I forgot the name]. Some remain unmixed yet as some got integrated into either sinhala or tamil.
- Some Tv program recently showed that SL has some unmixed negro villages too. [The Magngnavo song of late Granville Rodrego was supposed to be composed based on their language]
As you see, 1000s of years of ethnic separation is impractical. The nation called Sinhala is most likely the composite version of all who lived in SL, whereas the rest of ethnic groups are who came in recent times in big numbers and lived separately.
And they're all our brothers and sisters.
Guys
There is no point in arguing with Peelamists who hang on to LTTE's propaganda history of lanka.
Some of these deluded fools claim that Tamils orginated in SL and THEN migrated into South India. LOL!! Any respected world historian will laugh out of their ass if they hear this.
For all the huffing and puffing of Peelamists they still can't point out any Tamil artifacts that are older than the oldest Sinhala artifacts. All the oldest archeological evidence in the island are Sinhala ones(proto sinhala script). All the respected world historians and all the academic history books accept this.
These facts to Peelamists is like what kryptonite was to superman.
"India and Tamil Nadu"
Thanks DW
NO MIG-29S HAVE BEEN BOUGHT BY SRI LANKA.
This is a Good decesion .from the begining I was scepticle about this . I have heard tha Bangladesh has bought couple MIG 29 Birds and meianianace is a very high costly or someting
[How can the 5 Mig-29s cost $500 million?]
Yes, right, DW or DW's wife, where did you get this figure?
Mig 29 won't cost more than $30M now.
Thanks DW, However, I have some doubts about accuracy of DW's recent posts.
Yesterday DW said Chelian killed in Nachchikuda but all other sources say it happened in Mulative.
indians cannot order Sri lanka to do anything, but they can make a forceful request knowing that SL will oblige.
Before and during election time all politicians will shout but they are divided. Ruling party has banned LTTE, they can shout only about civilians.
any way looking at the whole post DW has not said much.
As a Sri Lankan ex-pat in the US, I count on Defence Wire for unbiased factual and technical correct reporting as carried out by you.
In fact we, the SL community in US discuss the contents in your website and we are impressed.
Thank you and keep up the good work
DUTUGEMUNU
Sujeewa Kokawala
very good analysis brother . I am eargerly waiting to read your posts. You can start your own blog actually with this amount of info
Thanks DW.
It is kind of sad SLA have to meet an Indian election deadline.
NO MIG29s BOUGHT. It is surprising to see this as some bloggers said they are at KAB. Anyway not to spend money on MIG29 is wise at this time.
As far as coming fighting in Mulathiv jungle is considered current UAVs, kfirs, MIG27s and F7s will be enough as SLAF bombing range supposed to be reducing daily basis.
If we have money and thinking about the pride you may buy MIG29s. But when considering protecting SL sky SLAF must implement 3 D radars all over the SL sky.
GoldenEagle said...
defencewire
How can the 5 Mig-29s cost $500 million?
They cost about 15 million each. How did you get the $500 million figure?
---------------
He shoved it down his mouth and pulled it out of his a*se.
Folks,
"Troops reach Jayapuram "
Jayapuram Junction is situated 7km to the north of Nachchikuda on I 32. According to this news item troops have come very close to this junction. Tactically extremely advantageous. We have almost encircled Nachchikuda.
click here.
From Rana,
"Yesterday DW said Chelian killed in Nachchikuda but all other sources say it happened in Mulative."
From the same article I have posted above.
"A senior Tiger leader was also feared killed as troops operating south of Pooneryn hit one of the double cabs which was escorted by a few Tiger cadres on Friday evening. "
One week back I said that Nachchikuda would fall within one week. Now it seems would take few more days. Apology.
DefenceWire,
Can you please enlighten us about the trenches built by LTTE. In certain places, I read that LTTE has built 2 or more lines of trenches spanning from Kilinochchi to Nachchikuda. At another place, I read that 58 has gone 7 km north of Nachchikuda. I guess that this is a rapidly changing scenario. Can you please keep us educated about our situation at these trenches.
Sujeeva,
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. That was very informative and I will keep this for future reference.
Defencewire,
I agree with all points in your list. We also need to give special attention on certain points there depending on current circumstances. For example;
/*
5. strengthen this new understanding regionally and globally
*/
Vezha uses local and agents in TN for shit stirring in order to put pressure on the military operation. Based on New Indian Express survey it seems some of it has worked. We have to understand the Tamil population there in not the most sophisticated. These village bums must get our message in a way they understand as well. We need to hire a PR firm in TN to counter LTTE propaganda as well as raising awarenesses of progress we have made in the social and economic sphere as far as the Tamil population is concerned.
There is so much we can share. Our HC in TN made special provisions so that refugees there sat for exams. There are have been many developments in up country Tamils of Indian origin with new schools, hospitals and IT facilities built for them. Then there many developments in progress in the East etc.
Communication, propaganda and regional dialogue we sometimes do not give much importance. We need to help Jayalalitha et al in their fight against Tamilzh extremism.
Defence Wire,
Could we trust Karuna.... I dont mean that because he a tamil. But LTTE is know for their grand plans ( as was done to President Premadasa). Could it not be possible that he (Karuna) or some one under him has not exactly shed their stripes and waiting for the opportune moment. I hope at least the President and the Army commanders security has taken that scenario in to consideration... In the past we always got "buggered" when we go out of our way and trust people with out a backup plan.
Or may I am just being paranoid..
Moshe,
"thanks for the news. the box strategy works and what's more it helps to BYPASS trenches as well!!"
You are welcome mate. 58 div did overrun the relevant part of the earth bund around one week back. But, of course they bypassed the trenches around Nachchikuda. I am waiting for the 'When'.
This is good news, if SLG has come to its senses and abandoned the Mig29 deal for now. There was news from Sri Lanka speculating the aircraft had already arrived while waiting for support such as training and handling to be matched.
SLAF already has all the toys it needs and can and must do the job with what they have.
There also has to be some kind of symbolic "We are sorry" gesture for 83 and other mistakes as AmgG mentioned. Invite regional Tamilzh leaders for the event as well. These are all smart politics and diplomacy that is needed to survive in this region.
hemantha,
there was a pic of the trnch/bund in a tamil newspaper published in a foreign country.
should have taken a copy.
it showed a deep and wide trench, a high bund immediately following it and another (smaller) trench and a smaller bund. in that order. beyond the smaller bund there were LTTE fortifications (gun positions).
WHEN we can render these useless, it will be a marvelouis victory. another COMPETENCY the SLDFs gained. hope the DETAIL operational strategies are well documented.
sala salang,
Your tool works great. Where does it maintain the list? We should be able share the list if it is read off text file. Is there any way you can add a menu item to add these buggers when we click on ID line instead of adding them manually. Nevertheless, it does trick and I love it. That AssRajiv can no longer litter my view. Great work.
India's Advisor for National Defense M.K. Narayanan has told Sri Lanka's deputy High Commissioner for India Palithe Ganegoda that military and other aid from India would be stopped if the operations being carried out in Wanni are not stopped immediately.
Chief Minister of Tamil Nadu government K. Karunanidhi had informed Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh that their support to the Central government would be withdrawn if India didn't stop the attacks on Tamil people by Sri Lankan Security Forces in Wanni. As such, the talk that is going round diplomatic circles is that a powerful official from India would arrive in the island soon to convey the Indian order to halt Wanni operations immediately.
Moshe,
You are correct. Kings had many strategies survive in this hostile region and recorded in the Chronicle. There are things we can replicate but also some innovation is required to keep up with the times. The approach taken by JHU for example is very primitive. They in fact are a liability.
Do we have to start or stop militory actions to apeace f**king indians? They are basterds who create this problem. Why they have banned LTTE?
This is the time we should stand firm but with good strategies.
first make China and Pakistan come out openly criticising Indian's dirty politics. If they can declare "do not interfere with SL affairs or we will be into the equation" Indians will back off.
However, environment is different to 1987, this 2008, I do not think Indians will apply force to SL now?
What do you all think?
500 Million!! Impossible!!
India's hope is to use a combination of strategies to make SL do her bidding.
There is very little likelihood of Indian direct military involvement against SL now or soon.
Teh reason being they have more to lose by doing so.
Moshe,
Adding to your sentiments of exploiting regional issues to our favor, we must also think globally how we can spread our influence there as well. We have to rise up to the occasion as we did with SAARC and find niches for ourselves as a global player. When we have influence over key players globally, dealing with issues like GSP+ will become a non-issue.
The Scandinavians for example wanted to create a niche for themselves as "conflict resolution specialists" but failed miserably starting from Palatine conflict to the our one. We have a chance here to show how to do it properly.
rana,
yes. times have changed and india cannot do half the things they did in 1987.
also india cannot lose the only friend in the region. actually they can IF tamil elam is created and TE will be the humble servant of india forever.
however, IF we don't co-operate, india can make things difficult for us. indian navy's contribution has been significant to stop arms smuggling, etc. we need all that.
we cannot completely disregard indian petty politics. OTOH if TN hardens the centre to follow a more agressive policy, we are at risk of losing support.
obama on one side and india on another! we have to play our diplomatic cards well. confrontation/antogonisation are not options.
moshe,
mathamathica gave us some valuable information about how we handled things in the past when we had strong ties to the Magadha Kingdom and Maurya Dynasty. Situation is little bit different today as far as Indian politics are concerned. Nevertheless, we should reignite our ethnic ties with the modern Magadha areas. At the same time we should strengthen our times with moderate Tamilnadu. Anyway, I believe that only a few educated Indians are intensely aware today of our ethnic ties to the North Eastern part of India. Therefore, we need to reignite and rekindle our ties by diplomacy, culture, and education etc. I hear that in the past, popular Tamil politicians like MGR visited Colombo so often and Eelamist had no chance in getting Tamilnadu against us. It was JRJ’s half thought pro American stance that killed our relationship after 1977. Anyway, the stronger our ties with India, the lesser we have to worry about India taking over Sri Lanka, matter of fact, our ancestors did the job 2500 years ago and Indians are our long forgotten cousins in the fatherland. On the side it is necessary to tell the JVP clowns that their Indian Expansionism theory is mere crap since we are the manifestation of the Indian Expansionism in Sri Lanka that dates back to 500 BCE. We should act in mutually trusted manner with India in the way we deal with our cousins (indeed they are). By doing so, not only we can secure peace in Sri Lanka for now and any future threat, we also can bring prosperity by tapping on to the Indian market.
panhinda,
very good point.
proximity does not matter anylonger.
sam,
of course.
ninja,
/*
a powerful official from India would arrive in the island soon to convey the Indian order to halt Wanni operations immediately.
*/
Is this a news from a public web site? or from where you quoted this?
Defencewire another load of bullshit analysis as usual. Sri Lanka is desperate to finish the war before the next elections because the BJP will come to power.
Jayallitha is on a pro Sri Lankan attidute with the blessing and knowledge that this will be the what the BJP would also see as their next Hindutava avenue. Look for the comming state elections in India for a rough guide.
You guys are really comedians. Pakistan is supporting the Taliban and Jihadist in kashmir and they what Sri Lanka to elimate terrorist. This is the biggest joke of the day. I always get a laugh when you write your analysis. Guess the first entry in the blog sums why you can sell your bullshit because they do not have a clue.
Guess, you better stay clear of Pakistan when Obama becomes President cause unlike the Republicans, the Democrats are going to give them what is comming to them.
We have no confirmation of such a Indian intervention, at least in defence circles. political circles, we do not know. But if such a request is made the defence circles would be appraised. We do not think this will happen.
$500 million was what was quoted by a former communist country for a classified transaction involving MiG29s. This deal did not go through. We will stop at that.
Troops are between Nachchikuda and Vallaipaadu, Pooneryn. They have advanced around 7km. that is correct.
There are at least four tranchlines in the northwest and northeast. other mini bunds are under construction in haste. These are being gradually identified and attacked.
Not buying the MIGs. Oh my god what happened looks like Mahindha mama is realising that the country is going to be bankurpt. Why dont you tell the readers that the 500 million dollars is used to stablise the rupee else it would collapse. The central banker is another joker.
Tea has had a bad year. Furthermore demand is going to drop. Mahindha Mama is losing options and so now he is saying this. So all the lies by the Mahindha brothers on the need of the Migs have gone down the drain.
Sri Lanka is going down the drains thanks to the Mahindha mamas. Worst id the armed forces boss is also showing the desperation by pouting out racial undertones to the western media.
Defencenet is another example of the desperation. They announced chelian got killed. Later in a response in their blog they said these things like this need time to confirm. Hence they are also resorting to desperate headline grabbing. Are you all under pressure from Gota Mama to hoodwink the people. If so you can fool some people some of the time but not fool all the pepople all the time.
Navindran: "I always get a laugh when you write your analysis."
Do u laugh and laugh and laugh till ur shit ur brain out? ha ha ha
Do u c "slippery dreams" of Obama?
Bhahiravayoo,
/*
Mig 29 won't cost more than $30M now.
*/
hah!! in e-bay, you can buy it starting from 7$..
history
It was from lankatruth, I am not sure about the relaibility. But this for what now LTTE is working on very hardly with TN.
Pakistan and China will be there when it comes to arms procureing. But none of them will involve IF India intervene. You like it or not India can stop SLA operations if they want. (They proved it once.) Question is will India 'order' SL to stop the war and if so when? Clrearly, we need at least another 1+ years to end the war. And IF india wanted it, that's it; game over.
Mahindha mama talks about political solutions now. What happen is it going to backtrack. Defencewire all the points you gave supposed to be done before the war started not now. Too late.
In months to come a bloated civil service and army is going to cause more problems then you can dream of. I guess Mahindha realises that the War on Terror under the republicans will come to an end. You should watch Jay Leno of the tonight show or John Stewart from comedy central. There is a reason these guys make around 20 million US dollars a year.
Its sad that the stupid politicians have no solution to the problem. I guess a uprising by the people will result in the comming months. With the severe economic recession comming in the world, mahindha mama cannot do anything but keep spewing rubbish. Even Gota cannot go back to 7/11 bussiness.
May Sarath will regret not taking up american citizenship. I guess his intelligence is as good as he gives interviews. Honestly he should try to run for US vice president like Sarah Palin.
[$500 million was what was quoted by a former communist country for a classified transaction involving MiG29s. This deal did not go through. We will stop at that.]
DW,
At max, Mig-29 will cost about $30M, so MR company wanted to have the stake in $350M commission? I would say there is at least $50M guaranteed commission.
Anything in the range of $100m deal would make sense for SL which has no capability to amass $500m for any single transaction. DW, when you tell sweet lies, please make it believable.
ninja,
Careful with some of these sites. They are either pro government or pro opposition/anti-government. I think you know this.
There is no sign of an Indian intervention at this point. The so-called 'genocide' of Tamils has not happened. As defenceanalyst would say, a genocide is the anihilation of an entire people. LTTE has only 275,000 tamils in their areas. All of them are safe and sound in Mulaitivu.
If you look at international interventions it is usually legitimated when government's fail. Although this government's performance is less than remarkable, it has taken it to the LTTE. I think even India will be compelled to give them a few more months at least. After all, noone wants to bet on a losing horse or not bet on one that is showing the highest likelihood of success.
bhairav,
I think the person who made the sweet lie, which you swallowed like a glutton is Mr. Prabhakaran. At least I'm here to reply. Where is he?
Navindran,
Diaspora.. my man, Keep singing..
BUT
It is the leader, and a handfull of brave soldies that need to win a war..
BUT
It is harder to talk about the diplomatic perspective of this as we cannot see the real picture..
BUT
As I always says, it is the LRRP unit, and that will gain us the victory here.. we need to make them strong as much as we can..
DW
I posted it from lankatruth and it pro-JVP site (if not official JVP site). You can see the first sentence can't be true as it has the word 'immediately' stop military operations. After JVP left MR time to time they put some BS and some are directly from pro-LTTE sites (they don't quote).
However, LTTE is working very very hard on tamilnadu factor as LTTE knows it is the single most effective weapon they can have. OTOH while GSL has very little or no options to neutralize TN politics GSL plays very loose shots. example; GenSF's recent statement. I believe GSL need to manage very seriously this Indian factor.
navindran,
you are getting increasingly desperate as the LTTE controlled area shrinks (and stinks!!).
SL economic worries CAN BE greatly reduced when we capture vanni which is a repository of valuable minerals, agricultural/fisheries potential, etc.
this will be the real "peace dividend".
that should be part of mahinda's solution to the economic problems. you sow to harvest, isn't it????
Whether it is sneaky Indian factor or US factor or Euro factor or whatever, it's Tamils who dictate their destiny.
Sellout woe,Jeyalaitha, and the scumbag senior citizen, Karuna, are using the Eelam cards for their next CM position and Indian central government will act like they are listening to these chair addict scumbags until the election is over, then they will go back to their old policy.
the blog looks very clean thanks to sala salang's add-on. No Navindrans, AssRajiv etc unless I chose to view them. Keep up good work.
Guys, I met few dozen Indian Tamils in Canada and US, 99% of them do not know what's happening in SL- they all are self centered arseholes. In many occasions they do not support the LTTE- that's the hard fact.
The rationale for the purchase of Mig29 came from unreliable intelligence pointing to LTTE having procured combat aircraft I believe. When the LTTE kept making the decoy runway wider, some got overly worried and reinforced the need for Mig29. The purchase of Mig29 was therefore based on flawed reasoning and without a proper cost benefit analysis. It’s a “nice to have” but not prudent financial commitment.
1. india
2. monsoon
3. newton
4. god
5. obama
6. international community
7. GSP+
8. EU
9. human rights council elections
10. iran
11. amnesty international
12. UN
13. UNP
14. JVP
15. budget
16. economic crisis
17. oil prices
18. BJP
..........................
what else can save the sorry arses of the LTTE?
when you look back at these doomsayers' former predictions, its fcuking hilarious. nevermind let them live in their fools' paradice.
Bhariav,
/*
Whether it is sneaky Indian factor or US factor or Euro factor or whatever, it's Tamils who dictate their destiny.
*/
When you share a space with other, its consensus, negotiations and democracy that paves way to solutions. No one is going to dictate terms to other. This is where you and other Jaffanese fail to understand. You cannot dictate to others what you want at the expense of others. I realise you need LTTE to do this. However, you must understand, solutions that are realised with the barrel of a gun cannot ever be sustained.
Navindran, your language has taken a turn for the worse recently. Are you having a bad day? Is the international financial situation bothering you?
Poor navindran donkey is getting increasingly desperate .. lol
DW,
Very thoughful Q&A analysis.
Indian policies with regard to Sri Lanka are a big unknown. The policies can best be described as erratic. The Congress Government, which is a coalition Government of regional parties headed by an Italian woman, with a a Sikh as a figurehead, will be ousted in the next election, and replaced by the BJP. The Indian bureaucracy still operates in the same mould as they did twenty years ago. This can be seen in the pronouncements made by MK Narayan, the National Security Advisor. This man is a Tamil with a background in the intelligence agencies. I believe he was involved in the RAW activities in Sri Lanka back in the days of the IPKF. Narayanan acts very much like Dixit, almost like a viceroy. The Rajapakse Govt to their credit has managed this very complex relationship with India very astutely.
sam perera,
"I hear that in the past, popular Tamil politicians like MGR visited Colombo so often and Eelamist had no chance in getting Tamilnadu against us."
MGR was originally from Sri Lanka and from what I understand he was anti-Eelam for a long time. At the International Tamil Conference in Madurai in 1981, MGR had Amirthalingam's Eelam exhibit torn down. Here is what Mervyn de Silva had to say about that incident:
"…To the accompaniment of loud applause by the Lake House and Times newspaper groups, the well-drilled cheer-squads of the Government, MGR has been accusing Amirthalingam of trying to disrupt good neighbourly relations between south India and Sri Lanka. In UNP eyes, MGR is indisputably the ‘good injun’. Conversely, in the Tamil Northern Province, he is as treacherous a villain as any manufactured by the prodigious movie factories of Madras. On January 22, police could not stop a crowd of Tamil youth in Jaffna, the provincial capital, from burning his effigy. The pro-TULF press has poured out such venomous words in the past fortnight that no cinema manager is likely to screen one of MGR’s once highly popular films for some time…"
Then 1983 occurred and MGR converted into the LTTE's greatest patron, showering Prabakaran with millions of dollars and elevating the LTTE above the other groups.
There is a reason why I use the term "Modaya" to describe Sinhala people who have helped the LTTE through idiocy.
DW,
great articles, i've been reading this blog for awhile, keep up the good work...
on the topic of arms...
I'd like to hear your assessment on the suitability of Su-25s for the SLAF... considering SLDF strategy, role of SLAF, aircraft capability, cost, etc, etc.
thanks...
Keep dreaming about defeating the freedom struggle. You always imagined you can divide tamils in TN and Tamil Eeelam. Thats is crumbling in front of you'r own eyes.
What else do you need convince the the climate is changing and sooner or later SLA will run. I am
already seeing this effect in SLA moral dropping significantly as every day is gong pass with
out the day of clear victory over Tamil Tigers. I can see the sihala racist readers of this blog
also losing their motivation seems to be little bit frustrated on the progress of their genociding army.
TN support for Tamils will only grow and grow. I see lot of ordinary Tamils in TN very angry about what Sri Lanka is doing to Tamils for last severals decades.
This will surely give moral boost to tamils and will have opposite effect on sihalese.
It is great to see that Pro-LTTE terrorist supporters are making hell a lot of predictions and forecasts on SL Economy, India, War, SLDF and etc.
They did not do this when the liberation operations were started. They just laughed at MR and Amry saying that LTTE cannot be defeated.
Its good that now they have recognized that LTTE is now desperate. The so called SL Economy, India, GSP+, Human Rights and even Obama is their last hopes.
Guys, how cool to have all these Jokers here to tell stories that we never thought they would tell?
"$500 million was what was quoted by a former communist country for a classified transaction involving MiG29s. This deal did not go through. We will stop at that."
That is extremely unlikely for 5 aircraft. That would place the purchase price almost on par with a latest generation stealth fighter such as F-22 and more than any other aircraft available today.
DN has mentioned that MiG-29's have already arrived. When it comes to matters about aircraft, bloggers are better off consuntling postings by people like nightfox and MiG29C on the LNP site. They actually know about aircraft and are more far more knowledgeable about technical matters than DW/DN.
There are two possible scenarios:
1. India will interfere and apply force to SL and save LTTE to regain lossess.
2. India will not interfere but continue to issue concerns and statements.
With second scenario no problems.
with the first:
1. If we stop the war, we will almost go back to square one, unless before that happens atleast capture A9 completely, clear west of A9 completely and clear EP causeway.
2. Do not listen to India but keep on hammering LTTE and take consequences. India will not invade SL but they can openly support LTTE and also supply essentials to them.
The secret of winning this war is speed, Israel always act speedily before any body else react.
We cannot afford to delay or stall attacks. We must win all attacks and win them quickly.
Do not forget how tamils TN were protesting aginst even thrir own Army when the war broke out with IPKF. Now they want sit and watch you sihalese butcher tamil women and children so that sihala racist can cheer and celebrate annihilation of tamils in eelam. Once tamils are wiped out you will be thingking about killing even tamils of TN in their own places like Rameswarm. Becuase Sri Lanka is already doing that to tamil fishermen. Sihalese can't be never co exist with tamils. When they are so blood thirsty for tamil blood, it does not matter where they come from.
FF,
Don't tell me about TN politics. Most of other indians do not give a hoot about what TN think.
It is Tamils who cannot live with other people, gradually whole world will understand that. It is now progressing well. Soon Tamils will be maginalised from ever corner, globly.
FreedomFighter
[When they are so blood thirsty for tamil blood, it does not matter where they come from.]
When you say these words it only shows your racist ideology. Moreover your profile picture clearly shows who is blood thirsty.
Man... you are sick.
guys,
who is this VESARANEE GOOSEKERA fcuking slutt?
she seems to hold an unsatiable grudge against the govt, patriotism and SL.
may be she is badly in need of what the IPKF gave away free of charge to northern women. i'm sure she will not complain. where is her brothel??? address? any idea?
Anda Wane! Mokada Wune!!!!
But Don't worry Bros, their Friends in TamilNadu will put an end to this...hic hic hic!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Australia considering Tiger ban
The Australian federal Government is considering listing the LTTE as a terror organisation, Foreign Minister Stephen Smith said.
http://www.dailymirror.lk/DM_BLOG/Sections/frmNewsDetailView.aspx?ARTID=28984
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Dear Moshe,
Good list of points supporting the forthcoming creation of Eeelam :)
Here goes some more:
19. Global Warming
20. Sri Lanka's Twenty20 loss to Pakistan
21. Road closure due to Benthota-Aluthgama damaged bridge
22. N Korea's removal from the terror list
23. Gayoom faces run-off in Maldives
Cheers
Sujeewa Kokawala said...
Once again a good write up....interesting reading:
How do you know about the caste that populated in either side of Galle so much?
Any books/ records you can refer?
Cheers Mate
sam,
Adding a context menu item to the right click on id line is something i have in mind for the next release.
The list is maintained in the firefox preferences, which can be accessed by typing 'about:config' in the address bar. Key used for the list is 'extensions.coloments.blacklist'.
You can type the key in to the filter to access the preference, and right click on the value to copy it.
The preferences are maintained in the file system under the firefox profile, in a file named 'prefs.js'. Editing this file might not be a good idea.
I'll see if adding multiple entries out of a file can be included in the next release.
happy to help
I'll be changing my nick to 'sithsala'
Wijayapala,
Most of the time I have seen reasonable facts and sound arguments from you. However, only a "modaya" will call another fellow being a "modaya" bro.
This is the war between a rebel group who is not willing to listen anything other than seperate country and a racist enemy who is not willing to give anything.
Only option for us is to support the rebels and win the war. but we are fighting against 30 times more than us. So we have to play some game here to get International support, specially India.
When enemy wants war, we should go for peace, when enemy want peace we should go for fight. This is what Sun Zu said. I think we already learnt that and doing well.
Kili hospital urgently need blood? Noh sorry Fuel!
Why? LTTE to transport heavy guns with continuously changing FDL!
Leaders double cabs or 4W drives need fuel urgently.
Govt, should not send diesel or petral to north only kerosene for civilians even that should be in limited amount.
medicine also should not send for high level injuries only low level day to day catering for civilians.
LTTE is eating food sent by Govt and feeding their cadres first. Medicine goes to treat their casualties first.
If F**king India wants SLGvtV to achieve results within a given period, do not send anything at all!
We are not holding civilians, Let LTTE is responsible for civilians they keep forcefully.
Majority of tamils like to stay with LTTE and help them, do not forget that.
V4, how about L4 looser,
Do anything mate, you will never get the peelam. I will guarantee it. Tamils can stand on their head but they will be without country forever, just b'cause what they have done to my beautiful country.
V4Victory,
[Only option for us is to support the rebels and win the war.]
Yes. Agree. Please don't stop your support for the war until the final tiger killed. If anyone think of peace and try to encourage, we should kill them first. Carry on brother..
v4v
You are partially correct. Here is the incorrect part.
If you agree that 'rebels' do not want any thing other than seperate country why do you expect any thing other than that?
But your enimy has given many other things and still give.
Given;
1. Provincial councils
2. Forign peace tours
3. Money and weapons (RP)
Still giving;
1. Food
2. Medicine
3. Fuel
4. Heavy veicles (NGOs)
So your complains/ accusations are very unfair.
_____________________________________________
BTW, GSL send food to wanni in private (rented) lorries. Recently police arrest few lorries with explosive etc. And finally they found the real owners of the lorries are LTTE itself. Thus GSL has paid rent for LTTE for their lorries for years.
So another thing GSL has given to your rebels.
BTW2, v4v you are civilized and honest terrorist unlike other podians.
Hi Rana,
you are saying ltte eat all food sent by the gov for the people of north.
Is it that possible to eat food for 2 lakhs people by only 5000 tigers? I dont think so.
Guys,
Sinhale, Sinhaladweepa, and Heledivayina or Heladiva are the early names used by people who lived in tiny island today known as Sri Lanka. The name Sri Lanka was given in 1970 after becoming a republic (turning point from innocence to thuggery and violence) scrapping the former name Ceylon (British given name).
Archaeological excavations discovered human remains which are around 34000 years old from Balangoda. They called it Balangoda man, or a group of hunters who lived in caves from Ruhuna to Mannar, rain forest that extends from Yala to Wilpattu. The remains and artefacts around Horton Plains suggest the presence of oats and barley with clay pots dating back to 14000 years.
Both of the above facts prove our early people were engaged in hunting as well as farming, man made tanks and irrigation canals in dry zones are solid factors.
Lot of people talk about Mahawansa but ignore Deepawansa, Thupawansa and Chulawansa almost all of them were written by Buddhist monks, they were fluent in the language called “Paali”. “Our present language derived mainly from Paali b’cause of high education of Buddhist monks who knew paali well. These scriptures mention three tribes who used to live in the island before Wijaya’s arrival from North India. These tribes were called “Raaksha”, “Naaga” and “Deva”. We can find evidence to suggest Raaksha as hunters, Deva as farmers and Naag as south Indians because they worshipped Cobra (fraction of Hindu). Rawana and Kuweni supposed to be from Raaksha tribe.
Then came Wijaya with his clan to Mannar and named the island as “Thambapanni” or island of Copper coloured palms. Wijaya got married to Kuweni (Raaksha queen). There is also evidence to suggest Muslims came from Egypt for trading purposes and some settled in the island. Later some people from Malay, and Java also came and settled in the island. Raaksha tribe always fought with Naaga tribe while Deva or farming people never bothered to fight with anybody. Then Buddhism was brought to this beautiful island and majority of farming people turned grabbed the opportunity and became Buddhists.
Later barbaric Europeans called Portugees, Dutch and English invaded the island. English responsible for bringing Tamils to upcountry as well as Kochchies (from Cochin) to low country as indenture labours,
So now, this what Gen.SF has said " SL belongs to sinhalese, others can live here if they obey law and order.
Those who can't go back to India or Canada, we don't care.
Sri Lanka is belongs to Sinhalese no more, no less. F**king Peelam has to be establish in somewhere else, not withing my SL. Vesapillei and Pottu have to die and we will destroy two legged tigers until they extinct from earth.
Hi Ninja,
You are right. You are giving food and medicine for our people. It is the responsibility of all governments waging war against its own people in the eyes of intel community.
Otherwise, we will be allowed to import ourselves by neighbor countries.
We are ready to send food and all to our people if your country and neighbor countries wont interrupt us. Then you dont need to send the foods.
Will your government allow this? I dont think so. They would say send through Colombo.
//you are saying ltte eat all food sent by the gov for the people of north.
Is it that possible to eat food for 2 lakhs people by only 5000 tigers? I dont think so.//
GSL send food for 2 laks people. How much your rebels can eat or can't eat is not our problem.
Think about fat a$$ vezapillai. How much food he eats as you think?
Ninja bro,
Please don't waste words on people who can't understand. They understand only one thing, bullet to the head.
The f**king india is 60 times bigger than SL, still they can't get a seperate stae in India. Why we should give them one? Tamils can go to hell as far as I am concerned.
We have tried every way to accomodate the basterds but monkeys (hanumantha) are monkeys. Let us get rid of the lot and finish this and purge the island from tamil cancer.
@ Rana,
nice post buddy,....
v4v
//We are ready to send food and all to our people if your country and neighbor countries wont interrupt us. Then you dont need to send the foods.//
How can you say this? are you some top leader collecting all the money from diaspora?
//Will your government allow this? I dont think so.//
I also don't think our GSL will risk lives of 2 lakhs tamils by giving a food contact to a blogger or a terrorist.
(But actually if LTTE need they can do this. In the same way you buy arms buy food and send them. But LTTE knows very well your enimy will send you the food.)
rana
Just for fun.
I dont know the regulations giving food directly but Tamil nadu people are in contact and are ready to provide substantial amounts of foods and all tamil diaspora will look after the rest if MR said yes.
Otherwise we have to wait some more time to make the way on our own.
Ninja, I understand bro!
Silent knight thanks bro!
the problem is the fat arse leader still eating our handouts, while Die-A$$-pora is sending money to keep VP's wife safe and educate his children in UK while tamil children uner 18 dying like pigs in the hand of SLDF.
Be real Die- A$$-Pora, how long you are going to do this. this monster, VP is not going to deliver anything for you, but frustration. You will be better off with Satan.
Hi Rana,
thanks for your advice.
I know VP made some mistakes as every leader does, but he never lied to anybody. He never said I am going to give up this struggle even in the beginning of last peace talks.
Only after his involvent in tamil politics, eelam tamils are survived, atleast in moral terms.
Karunanithi in his last meeting said if eelam tamil are eliminated, we will perish too. Why he said like that. Is that only for political game?
We as tamils from eelam or India or malaysia or any other diaspora, give moral support for this struggle and believe in seperation is the only way out for this problem.
a brand new euro fighter was 120 million dollars an year ago.. BRAND NEW.. so for a used mig29 that some random is trying to refurbish and sell for close to 85 million dollars is bullshit.. ive been reading defencewire for ages now.. i dont even remember how long.. but lately the posts have been full of holes and nothing ads up.. defencenet is pure gossip.. and makes up stories if it doesnt have an article that has already been around teh defence.lk site and dailnews and dailymirror sites.. when im in SL in december im definitely going to the FDL.. only site i believe anymore is defence.lk i think you guys should get your news from there too.. TC..
V4, I ppreciate your reply bro,
What you need to understans is VP is brutal thug who will intensify suffering of your people, instead of liberating them. you must look else where for leader. Not this sambaru fat arse, he will only bring misery to your people.
We can't just waste our time educating you bro, we are busiy with eradicating kotties forever.
good night bro, I am goning to have my drink, dinner and then nice warm bed and a good fuck, not necessarily in that order.
Wijayapala,
(1/2)
”No, we do not agree, especially with regard to the LTTE. State discrimination was only one among many things that led to popular acceptance of Tamil nationalism.”
Except I didn’t say “Tamil nationalism” in the quote you were responding to, did I? I said “Tamil militancy”. The two are most definitely not the same thing. You would be drawing a very long bow indeed to blame ‘relative deprivation’ and ‘power hunger’, in other words postcolonial bitterness, for the rise of militancy in the 70s and especially 80s.
“Another factor was power-hunger (not very different from their Sinhala counterparts) and a sense of relative deprivation from Tamil leaders who were used to a privileged position in the colonial era. Tamil militancy was at least as much a product of the failures of the elder generation of Tamil leaders, very similar to the JVP. In fact, the Tamil student militants of the 1970s (NOT Prabakaran, who was not a "student" militant) took inspiration from both the 1st JVP uprising and the establishment of Bangladesh (the latter of which Indian intervention played a key role, as noticed by the young Tamil militants).”
Who are the elder generation of Tamil leaders you are referring to, and what were their failures? I will assume here you mean the All Ceylon Tamil Congress, the Federal Party, and TULF. These were nationalistic in a certain sense, but they were not militant, and they certainly did not advocate secession (until 1973 for the FP, 1977 for TULF). Their ‘failure’ in the 1940s, 50s, and 60s was not their failure at all, but the failure of the Sri Lanka state, paralysed by its Sinhala-Buddhist modus operandi, to make any acceptable concession to basic civil rights for Tamils. When Bandaranaike attempted even minor changes to the Sinhala Only Bill, he was assassinated by a Buddhist monk!
Forget the nationalist aspirations of Tamils for a moment – the legislative bent of the 50s and 60s was a blow to basic civil rights, let alone national aspirations. (My personal view is that if those civil rights had not been so flagrantly violated – and to repeat, they were violated because the state was rooted in racist Sinhala-Buddhist ideology – then Tamil nationalism would probably never have even soared towards secessionism).
Tamil nationalism transformed from being comparatively mild at the time of independence (there was no significant demand for a separate state, for instance); it emerged as a stronger force due to the increasingly racist character of the SL state, and was initially propelled by peaceful protests in the 1960s; stronger political (mostly non-violent) secessionist agitation emerged in the 1970s (TULF, 1977 election); and finally widespread violent rebellion in the 1980s.
Your analysis is toothless, because it cannot account for this shifting tide, i.e. the evolution of Tamil nationalism through the latter half of the 20th century. The emphasis you place on ‘intangibles’ like ‘relative deprivation’ and ‘power-hunger’ (in the sense that you mean these things, i.e. colonial memory) is impotent in the face of such phenomenon - the only variable that can explain these things was the rising level of racist State repression.
A few historical points. The ACTC and the Federal Party (until 1973) were ‘Tamil nationalist’ in the sense they advocated for Tamil rights, but this was qualitatively very different from agitating for a separate, ethnically-based state, which the FP did not do till 1973 (and which the Sinhala parties did from the onset). And that is the fundamental clincher: whereas the mainstream southern parties were cosying up to Sinhala-Buddhist nationalism (Sinhala Only Bill, standardisation etc), and erecting a State on explicity communalist grounds, the mainstream Tamil Parties (ACTC first, then the Federal Party) were not doing the equivalent. They pushed for equal rights and some autonomy, but not for a Tamil state (there may have been some people agitating for this, but they never reached the mainstream, whereas Sinhala-Buddhist nationalism was in the mainstream from day one, hence the discrimination from day one).
But by 1977, Tamil sentiment was clearly in favour of separation, as the TULF victories in that year’s elections demonstrated. The election was significant because it inspired a host of repressive measures against Tamils and their sympathisers in the years that followed, creating the conditions for both the ultimate rise of the LTTE after the riots, and, critically, for the riots themselves. In fact, there was a practice run for the ’83 riots in ‘77, as I’m sure you know.
And this is why I stated earlier: “the LTTE, and Tamil militancy more generally, had its origins in legitimate Tamil grievances, vis a vis state discrimination.”
"So who would be a better man to defeat the LTTE? Paikiasothy Saravanamuttu?"
This I can’t really answer, as I don’t support the war. But if I did, I’d probably try to find someone who does not spout racist ideas?
”The Rajapakse govt. has quite clearly taken a "hands-off" (laissez-faire) approach to Fonseka. My guess is that the Rajapakses have assessed (accurately) that the int'l community can never be roped in to help in a significant way to defeat the LTTE, based on the experience of the last 25+ years and especially the CFA.
Please note that the Rajapakse govt. is not conducting a US-style presidential campaign, where everything is scripted and handled to the extent of utterly negating the personal factor.”
I think this is unlikely, since the government is well aware that its human rights record may influence lucrative EU trading agreements (GSP+ scheme, accounting for nearly 40% of SL’s total export earnings), as well as general international prestige. You may not think the latter is important, but the government did spend $millions lobbying for that UN Human Rights Council seat last year, which it lost. The EU warned SL earlier this year that its deteriorating human rights record is jeopardising GSP+. Statements like Fonseka’s, on top of the well documented abuses against minorities, are unlikely to wash down well with the human rights groups that lobby the EU and UN and other countries/institutions that link trade concessions to human rights.
“You are digressing. The point is that the "conflict resolutionists" would insist that Prabakaran and his ilk have the legitimate right to believe that the N-E is the Tamil homeland, but Sinhalese people do not have similar rights to make ethno-centric statements. There is a double standard and that was the point.”
There may well be a double standard, but it is not my double standard, since that is not something that I believe, and not something I have ever stated I believe, here or elsewhere. I do not have any brief to defend the “conflict resolutionists”, whoever these mysterious bogeymen are.
”And this is all in a context of an unfair war against the LTTE which is a harmless group of kids holding hands and singing songs. Why don't you tell us a country which is in a similar situation, facing an enemy comparable to the LTTE. Do you know what the LTTE is?”
And yet my comment was not about the LTTE at all, but about civilians. Do you think that the war against the LTTE justifies the abduction and killing of civilians, and State repression against political parties that have nothing to do with the LTTE? This includes activists and journalists who are often opposed to LTTE, but commit the sin of being also critical of the government.
Have you thought about what the implications of such a stance for SL’s future, if the LTTE is actually defeated? Do you really think the government is just going to give up using the repressive apparatus it has fostered over the last 30+ years, when they have proved to be such efficacious tools against political foes and media rascals? Can you name a country where this has ever happened? The more easily rights are sacrificed, the more difficult it is to fight for them back.
Besides which, human rights are not for you or others to doll out like candy. For one, human rights are not granted, but are inalienable rights that all humans are endowed with. Your ‘they do it too!’ defence is as hollow as ‘I was only following orders’ was at Nuremberg.
”…and what would you expect for a region that had its first election in 14 years after being occupied by a fascist armed group?”
And how exactly does 14 years of occupation by the LTTE, justify intimidation and ballot stuffing in an election once the LTTE is evicted? Unless you accept that those who have has replaced that “fascist armed group” are just as bad, I do not see the validity of your logic. Feel free to explain.
(cont. below)
Perein,
Rana is almost right. When you read most of news from intel media they will say tamil rebels killed or be killed. so it is very difficult to diffrenciate tamil and tigers. They both refer tamils.
When you have problem in Colombo, you will arrest tamils only in search of tigers. right. this implies that both are same.
wijayapala,
(cont. from above)
“If I were to hazard a guess, I would say that you and “academics” out there disagree with my explanation because it is too simple and straightforward.“
Sometimes simple explanations are the best, ala Occam’s Razor. No, I disagree with your explanation because it is wrong, not because it is simple.
“Ethnonationalism is primarily a sentiment, not an ideology, and I can assure you that the above sentiment I wrote existed from at least the time that the Mahavamsa was written by Mahanama, a time when Buddhism was visibly disappearing in India and the Sinhalese realized that what they had in Sri Lanka was all that was left (a historical fact, not a myth). If you’re not a Sinhala it would be difficult for you to understand this sentiment, although not very different from how most Sinhalese don’t understand what it’s like to be a Tamil in Sri Lanka.”
I am not arguing that some of these ideas may have existed for a long time, but I am arguing that what emerged in the late 19th century was a new phenomenon in the way it mass packaged a Buddhist-Sinhala political identity, laced with all sorts of ugly undertones (like Aryanism). It was led by wealthy landowners and businessmen such as Amarasuriya, Abeywardena and Hewavitharana, and it was for interest of these layers (+ disenchanted clergy and intellectuals) that it stood. It was not a movement led from below, in stark contrast to mass labor movements, for instance. The LSSP, arguably the most powerful political movement of Labor and the national opposition after the '46 election, had no ethno-nationalist character at all. That groups like the LSSP were able to gain mass support amongst Sinhala working people puts lie to any suggestion that Sinhala-Buddhist nationalism is some unbridgeable constant.
The notion that people like Amarasuriya, Abeywardena and Hewavitharana, and the other layers who were at the forefront of the revivalist movement, were animated by some abstract fear of the Sinhala race being wiped out of existence, is frankly comical. They may well have tapped into such feelings – but for what purpose they tapped into these feelings is the important question, and that is all to do with their material interests.
People like Dharmapalla dragged the Mahavamsa to the forefront of political discourse, and selectively retrieved elements from it to support their communalist ideology. This is what I mean when I say that your perspective is ahistorical. You point to the Mahavamsa, without accepting that the way the text was presented by Dharmpapala and his modern-day equivalents, the specific passages it has been mined for, and the way it has been infused into modern politics, has been shaped mostly by the history of the last 200 years, not the last 2000 years. This is the same way right-wingers in the West selectively quote from the Bible to condemn homosexuality or contraception or abortion, for political purposes. Anti-homosexuality, or anti-birth control, or anti-abortionism, were never ‘widespread sentiments’, they are sentiments cynically crafted to give a populist base to parties that would otherwise be very unpopular, because their policies represent narrow class interests.
Sinhala-Buddhist revivalism was not dissimilar to religious/ethnic revivalist movements all across the world, which also emerged at a similar time, such as Romantic German nationalism. These were all equally ugly, and we know where it led to in Germany (I also know what it led to in Sri Lanka.).
“The outward manifestation of Sinhala nationalism has changed from medieval through colonial to modern times, but the above basis remains the same. When Christian missionaries launched a campaign to wipe out heathen faiths in the island through proselytization and state sanction, monks like Gunananda dug their heels in and fought back in venues such as Panadura because they were literally defending their beliefs from extinction. Then there were the Sinhala vernacular teachers and traditional medical practitioners threatened by the dominance of English education and Western medicine. When the British imported S. Indian workers and entrepreneurs to work the plantations and economically integrate the island with their empire, both Sinhala labor and capital closed ranks against these immigrants because they correctly believed that they would get squeezed out of their only habitat. “
And yet the “outward manifestation” is key, not some throwaway line. What emerged in the late 19th century was very different from any sentiment that had existed before it – there is a reason, after all, that it is called Sinhala-Buddhist revivalism. Even if it were true that there has always existed some latent anxiety in Sinhala consciousness (and here I fear you delve into the realm of psychobabble), that their identity is under threat from without (I am not convinced that this was so), the fact remains that these sentiments were tapped into by people with definite political interests. The significance of the late 19th century is that another powerful force was emerging as a contender for political power – labour. Relgio-ethnic revivalism was the right-wing contender to this emerging force, fearful as it was of a united labor movement, especially one which could cross ethnic lines (as during the 1953 Hartal, an alarm bell indeed for the establishment).
The example of Sinhala labor and capital closing ranks against immigrants is not dissimilar to the protectionist economic policies that many countries institute today. They are a naïve attempt to protect local jobs and local profits. Nothing to do with race or ethnicity – ethnicity may be used as a rallying cry, if convenient, but it is not the underlying motivator. Economic self-interest trumps anything else; before people can bother with silly sentiments, they must be able to put food on the table. The anecdotes about Buddhist monks digging in their heals prove nothing. There may have been some principled monks, but there were also others who accommodated the British. In fact, there was a general rapprochement between Buddhism and the European overlords until the 19th century, and heroic tales like that you describe were the exception not the rule – how do you explain this? If the sentiment you describe was so strong, there would have been no rapproachment, and there would have been no need for revivalism, as these currents would have always existed.
“And my point is that there’s much more to the story. What drove Tamil militancy into the mainstream was not Sinhala nationalism in general (contrary to what most “conflict resolutionists” believe) but a very specific event- the 1983 riots. Before this event, the critical mass of Tamils did not endorse militancy to the point that they would risk their lives participating in or supporting it.”
I address this above. In a nutshell, you are ignoring the fact that Tamil nationalism evolved from being non-violent and civil rights oriented, towards peaceful secessionism, and ultimately secessionism by force. The repressive policies of the Sri Lankan state towards Tamils, pandering to Sinhala nationalist interests, was responsible for this.
1983 was of course very important. It was a catalyst and the culmination of what had been fostered by the State for the previous 40 years, not an incident in a vacuum. Or do you think that 1983 was merely some historical ‘accident’, an ‘aberration’ that had nothing to do with the fact that the State had cultivated Sinhala nationalism, demonised the TULF and Tamils in general as traitors and even terrorists?
“Somone who doesn’t ascribe significance to Thalaivar probably does so without a very good knowledge of the history of Tamil nationalism and militancy. If Prabakaran had never existed, this history would have taken a very different turn. There would have been no LTTE and much more importantly no other Tamil militant group like the LTTE. I would argue that the experience of this particular conflict demonstrates that individuals matter, that one cannot explain history as simply a function of political theory and broad trends.”
The 1977 election demonstrates that, by 1977, Tamils in the North and East felt the only way they could live in dignity was in an independent, secular Tamil state (whether or not this was accurate is another question). The events of 1983 only emboldened this view. As it so happens, the LTTE ultimately emerged as the only group fighting for separation, in other words, the only group fighting for what Tamils demanded in the ’77 election. This was and remains the basis of the LTTE’s support: the belief that the Sri Lankan political system cannot realise Tamil aspirations because of its structural faults, and that the LTTE is their best chance of realising these aspirations. I see no reason why other groups would not have emerged to take advantage of sentiment, if the LTTE not existed.
”But hundreds/thousands did not in fact flock to his arms. Prabakaran only managed to gather 30 recruits in the 7 long years between the LTTE’s establishment in 1976 and the 1983 riots. The total number of Tamil militants of all groups by 1983 numbered only 200, and the LTTE was the only active group by that year.”
Yes, because they still tethered their hopes to the political process. It was not just the 1983 riots that shattered these hopes, but a wave of repression against Tamils between 1977 and 1983, as well. I don’t see how the points you raise counter my argument that the LTTE’s rise was, at its essence, a response to Sinhala-Buddhist nationalism, since the 1983 riots were an example par excellence of the consequences of Sinhala-Buddhist nationalism.
”The TNA influence was certainly not negligible. It was one of the factors that led the UNF to sign a highly-lopsided CFA and enter into a peace process that tied the government’s hands and allow the LTTE to consolidate its gains. The only reason that TNA ministers were not appointed was because they were not authorized by the LTTE."
I'm not aware of any allegations of widespread LTTE intimidation of voters in the 2001 election (though there was in 2004), which elected 15 TNA members if I recall correctly.
I'm not sure what you mean by 'consolidate its gains'. If you mean the LTTE was able to consolidate its power within territory it controlled without fear of attack, well, that's what a ceasefire does, and it was on the platform of peace that the UNP was elected. The fact that in early 2001 the country was on the verge of bankruptsy and was suffering a severe balance of payments crisis had much more to do with the ceasefire than the TNA. And in what way do you consider the ceasfire lopsided? It required the LTTE to drop its demand for a separate state, after all.
“Since you seem to be highly interested in the JHU, despite its low popularity/credibility among the Sinhalese, its nearly non-existent party discipline, and its single ministry, I’d like to hear your explanation how it won 9 seats in the 2004 election. What made the JHU into an influential force?”
The same processes that have led to similar fringe racist groups rising to prominence across the world (the Christian Right in the US, Hansonism in Australia, Le Pen in France, the neo-Fascists in Italy). Sharpening class antagonisms, grinding poverty, on a background of a decades-old war, foster fascistic tendencies.
If you have any doubts that the JHU espouses such tendencies, consider the following comment in the JHU’s officials statement on the murder of Tamil journalist Dharmaratnam Sivaram: “the death of the editor of the Tamilnet web site is the best example of the future fate of extremists who oppose the peace in the country”. This was tantamount to encouraging such attacks.
“I think that before we continue, we should have a better understanding of what we agree on. The LTTE has moved from being a dependent variable (although even that could be disputed) to an independent variable- it is shaping/defining Tamil nationalism, as opposed to being defined by Tamil nationalism. That is basically why I argue that when the LTTE leaves the scene, there will be space for other Tamils to move this nationalism in a healthier direction.”
And why do you believe that direction would be anywhere other than secession? Separation was the sentiment in 1977, and now Tamils have 30+ years of a racist war and sectarianism (promoted by both sides) to buttress their belief that they cannot live in a State under Sinhala-Buddhist hegemony.
guys,
any news from the battlefront??
there is a longer time lag for news to come lately.
v4victory-
Why do we have to follow the wrong foot steps?
We should avoid the racism if we need to win this war.
Sinhala / Tamil or Muslim, we are belongs to Sri Lanka.
LTTE terror is the problem and we should work together to sort it out
echolalia and Wijayapala,
As I understand you both represent the same group. What is the fucking discussion about?
[there is a longer time lag for news to come lately.]
i've notice that too...
is it due to us facing stronger resistance from the enemy???
Here good news for MR & Co World Bank says no more room for Lanka to borrow
And one more news from akkarayankulam where three soldiers went missing on sept 2nd and remains found oct 10.
last_mile,
If you are so interested, you can scroll up and read exactly what the discussion is about.
last_mile said...
"echolalia and Wijayapala,
As I understand you both represent the same group. What is the fucking discussion about?"
last mile, u have no idea about Wijayapal. Pls read what he writes not just look at them !
the other guy, have a good crack @ him for doing lot of "cut and paste"! real clown he is!
Amma Gahai/Gahawi,
What exactly did I cut and paste? Or are you just in the regular habit of making unfounded accusations?
I just read a Pro LTTE column in http://www.lankabusinessonline.com/fullstory.php?nid=660836305
He was spreading lies like that below. I guess now there needs to be an Unbaised Economic Blog giving the "real picture" of Sri Lanka's economy. Mahindha Mama all the way.
Fiscal Crisis
In Sri Lanka, all inflation or currency pressure is fiscally triggered, by false budgets with over-estimated revenues and under-estimated expenses driven by mentally-challenged economic policies.
The sudden jump of 32 billion rupees worth of Treasury bills in the central bank's stock in October is an outward sign of this problem.
The Ceylon Petroleum Corporation also seems to have compounded the problem by borrowing millions of short-term dollars from Iran and creating a dangerous risk to the country's economic and monetary stability.
If petroleum was fully in private hands this problem would not have arisen. If Lanka IOC was not there the risk overhang to the country would have been 30 percent greater. CPC is now externally leveraged by around 500 million dollars, according to official statements. That is a significant chunk of the country's foreign reserves.
No private sector entity could have run that kind of debt in the space of four or five months, due to the credit risk. Only state and political power can create that type of dangerous overhang. The sooner CPC is privatized the better, for the stability of this country.
When market fundamentals finally override state control, just like global markets are now crashing from sustained paper money central banking also helped by the manipulation of housing interest rates in the US by state sponsored Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, the chickens come home to roost.
You speak of oppression and the Tamils. That was your propaganda. It is pointless saying that to me, because I know the facts, and the misinformation methods pursued against our people. Of course, there could have been administrative mistakes, errors of judgment, human failings in a long dependent country struggling to stand on its feet. But oppression or deliberate discrimination, never. The strident claim of a few ambitious persons for special position for the Tamil people within Sri Lanka was born long before the SLFP or even the UNP was founded. It was the same claim that was later advanced in to Federalism and Eelam: and many inaccuracies and distortions, including that of our national history, became necessary to propel that political line: and whereas the facts and statistics of national performance will show that the Tamil people in the country must have always been among the most privileged minorities in the world.
-Mrs Sirima Bandaranaike, the Leader of the Sri Lanka Freedom Party in her reply to a letter addressed to her by A.Amrithalingam, the Leader of the Tamil United Liberation Front, exhorting her not to oppose the Indo-Lanka accord of 1987.
In countunation that "liar" as per Mahindha Mama's logic as he praises Singapore's financial system led by a Sri Lankan called Tharman Shanmugaretnam. Unfortunately he has praised this man. For example when the Aussie fell from US 0.98 to 1 Aus to now US 0.64-0.67 range to 1 Aus , Singapore Dollar went from US0.746 to US 0.68 to match the drop in commodity price.
Quickly the defence organisations should act to pick him up in a white van. He is Pro LTTE as he speaks against Mahindha mama's chikunkunya policies which is destroying Sri Lanka.
Anyway keep singing your lah lah stories to those who believe you.
Dear Navindarn,
Tigers have to be totally silenced if Lankan Tamils need their equal rights – Cho Ramaswamy
http://www.asiantribune.com/?q=node/13674
Says Cho. Do you disagree? If so why machan?
Navindran,
You are trying to diversify the attention. Shall we talk about the LTTE's recent victories here since lot of peoples have sent them lot of funds??
--
If Army could capture all the territory from the LTTE, and if the GOSL decided to grant
Mr. MR - $ 50m
Mr. GR - $ 40m
Gen. SF -$ 30m
as a gift for service what they have done, all the patriots will be agree to that. :)
So please do not bother about the countries economy at this crucial time.
B#1
That if and if and if hapeened, you all should give more to SF.
That if and if and if not happened,
we will take cre of them.
echolalia you too can't hide spots like wijayapala.
V4Victoria,
Bro, I owe you answer from the previous thread.
>>>Why you say DiAssPro to denote tamil diaspora, then you say Good DiAssPro too? <<<
Diaspora = DiAssPora= The-Ass- Pora. Whereas DiAssPro is a mistype. Don't think too much of these things bro. Whatever I write in reply to a DiAssPora Bro, is purely to convey my hatred. So even if I say my dear...it actually means ...k you! :))
To clarify, any human/ primate supporting the LTTE terrorist group....for me is another terrorist. There is nothing good about a terrorist....
However there are two types of such terrorists....in this blog. a) primates who keep on repeating the same record , b) the bit civilized ones who voice their views/ opposition in a civilized manner. Category b should be spared of replies spiced with vulgarity. Because we Sri Lankans believe in civilized discussions.
>>>>To whom you say this advice particularly? To me or To all tamils, in your word, all DiAssPro?<<<<<
To anybody who comes to this blog and questions DW's sincerity. What I believe is he/she/team is trying to do decent job with limited resources/ information available.
Cheers Bro
Yours Hatefully, Your vengefully :))
Apino
Dear Bro Naveendran,
I salute you for your valiant efforts in bringing about the Eeelam, simply by manipulating the Financial Markets. Man that's a novelty. Guess SLDF will have to form a new LRRP unit comprising of Financial experts.
Keep up the woodwork. At least we get some update on the financial markets.
Cheers Mate.
Hi Apino
Good to see u again.
Yes I hardly understand that it is hard to talk with a person who has diffrent views. We have only seperated by our politics, but you see, it is hard to tolerate. Replies come with the words which is, i Think, more than a terrorist does. Maybe i expect too much in this CIVILIZED world.
By going through this kind of conversation, be frankly, I can understand, we are seperated more and more. We couldnt have a conversation friendly only because we are diffrent opinions on our political future.
If you guys hate ltte, that could be acceptable. but you cannot deny our aspiration. We had enough more than enough. That is why we want to decide our own destiny. LTTE choosed one way, TNA choosed other way, This cannot be tolerated by the governement, but why u?
You should understand other side of people. If ltte is eliminated, everything is going to be solved. No.
Naveendran Bro,
Could you please tell me/ us how LTTE will recover from this current situation: loss of east, loss of carders, about to loose their political capital, loss of international reputation ( i.e. front orgs busted, banned as Terror group etc.) ???
If it makes it easy, just cover key milestones on LTTE's road to recovery and creation of Eelam. Forget about Eeelam creation, just tell us how LTTE will return to its Pre-Peace Talk strengths: leadership wise, logistically, geographical coverage etc.
I aks this question, because lot of your fellow DiAssPora bros have foretold how LTTE will trap and decimate the SLDF in Vanni.
Others are welcome to chip in.
Over to you Bro?
echolalia, you write "Have you thought about what the implications of such a stance for SL’s future, if the LTTE is actually defeated?"
Have you though about the implications for the Tamils if LTTE wins? A fascist dictatorship to be ruled by VP and his descendants were all human rights are openly ignored. VP has systematically killed all Tamils opposing Sri Lanka who does not support him, so LTTE is the only realistic alterantive to Sri Lanka now. Whatever problems Sri Lanka have they are small compared to those in LTTE controlled territory.
infinity,
I do not accept that the LTTE's violations against Tamils are any worse than those of the Sri Lankan government against Tamils, so your 'lesser of two evils' argument does not hold water. What exactly has the LTTE done to Tamils that the Sri Lankan government has not, at some point or another?
But even if I were to accept your argument, that the LTTE is worse, I do not accept your theory that no opposition could grow against the LTTE. Repression actually creates its own solution: resistance (this is the reason there is a civil war in Sri Lanka today).
In actual fact, if the Sri Lankan army were to withdraw from the Tamil areas of the North and East, and the LTTE were to establish an independent state, this would pave the way for more vociferous opposition to the Tigers by ordinary Tamils. This would be for three reasons:
1. Political repression, as discussed above, would drive many Tamils away from the LTTE
2. Tamils would be far less willing to accept such political repression, as the Tigers would no longer be able to blame it on a war against the SL government. This is probably the most important point, as the LTTE presently justifies its repression on the grounds that there is a raging war, and promises democracy once the war is over. This would be shown false.
3. It would highlight the fact that an independent Tamil state would in no way bring about an improvement in material livelihood for the mass of people.
Dear V4V,
Likewise man. Good to see you too.
I respect your yearning to reach out to the other side and enlighten them.
But we have gone too far for that. We have drawn our battle lines and drawn blood.
But let me state few things.
a) Yes you guys had enough! be your own doing or somebody else....I think its both. No human should go though that ever again. I'm talking about the civilians in Vanni ( including the youth who joined the LTTE, after all they were civilians first) not the disenfranchised DiAssPora.
b) You are entitled for your aspirations and we have our own. Where they collide, then the survival of the fittest rule applies. That's why I say, if you can get your Eeelam, fine your earned it. Both our sides have lost the opportunities for mitigation.
c) Realistically, I the Apino cannot influence the outcome in anyway. But if I can do anything about it, I will crush the LTTE, including anybody even remotely related. Do it so ruthlessly, so that generations to come (on both sides) will remember it. But for the survivors, I will treat them as my own kids...you get the drift. Be generous, give them their self respect, cultural identity...and the whole nine yards....But there is a but....within one united Sri Lanka...Need I name the countries who are practicing this approach? Bro cannot make all of them happy all the time.
d) I believe in fighting a all out war. No holes bard. Attack the enemy on all fronts. Make it real dirty but finish it quick kind of approach. Anything in between will prolong the suffering on both sides. Whats the fun in getting young Aruna from Mahiyangane to go and kill young Arun from Madawachiya. In their youth they should be humping badu like hell man. ( I'm glad Aunty Ruwani is not hear today!! /:))
In summary Bro, lets fight this out. Be it Eelam, or United Sri Lanka....I'm sure the emerging entity/ entities will be too tired to do battles for another 100 years. Both of us have brought it upon ourselves....so be done with it fast.
They say, "If your going through Hell, keep going"
Cheers Man
echolalia, you seem to have a strange double standard. You argue that if the war ceased then there would be less human rights violations by the LTTE in the territory they control. Why would not exactly the same thing happen in government controlled territories if LTTE stop their terrorism?
You reveal your allegiance when you deny the much worse atrocities in LTTE controlled areas:
Sri Lanka - VP's dictatorship
Many parties - one party
Many government critical groups and newspapers - no critical voices allowed of any kind
Elected government - dictator who plans to make his son dictator after him
Volunteer army - Forced conscription with torture of deserters
Freedom of movement - Pass system prevent civilians from leaving a war zone
Freedom of assembly with lots of ant-government rallies etc - none
infinity,
I did not argue that there would be less human rights violations, I actually argued there would be the same level, or possibly more. What I did argue was that this repression would create the seeds of resistance. And yes, the same would happen in the South, as less people would be willing to accept government repression against opposition groups in the name of fighting the LTTE (since the war would be over). All this would be further exacerbated by the dire economic straits Sri Lanka and the rest of the world is facing, and is likely to face for some years now.
I don't see the double standard?
What you're arguing is that the human rights situation in Tamil areas would be better under the GoSL than under the LTTE. I see no evidence for this, especially based on the human rights record of GoSL areas in the North and East presently. All the freedoms you have listed that exist in SL are dubious even in the South, and close to non-existent in the North and East, particularly Jaffna. Freedom of press? You have got to be kidding me. Sri Lanka is the third most dangerous country in the world for journalists (source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sinhala/news/story/2007/12/071218_dangerous_press.shtml)
Note that groups like AI and HRW have always documented a massive escalation in human rights abuses once Tiger areas are taken over by the government. Jaffna was and is one of the most compelling examples, and now you can look to the Eastern Province for examples. Jaffna was taken by the government some 13 years ago, and today it is "one of the world's most dangerous places for journalists" (http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/25/asia/AS-GEN-Sri-Lanka-Media-Under-Attack.php)
Is this the sort of freedom you hope the GoSL will bring to the people of the North and East?
There seems to be some concern about the price that was quoted for the MiGs. I believe you have misunderstood it. To put it simply, this price was not only for the planes but for a much larger package deal including the overhauling of the MiGs and other armaments badly needed at that time. The bid was issued many months ago when government first encountered the TAF problem and other shortages. This offer was received from this ex-communist country for the supply of a variety of solutions and essential supplies. Immediately, a sunday defence columnist nabbed a copy of this letter and started highlighting only the MiGs deal. In fact, the package deal was rejected many many months ago because we had other options. Since that time we have managed to obtain on a fire now-pay later basis majority of our requirements from China, Pakistan and India. This includes radars, shells, rockets, missiles, guided bombs, tanks, APCs, spares etc. The government will get these weapons not in a package but on the basis of need, in small installments. This is more information than what we intended to give you but hope it enlightened you more. That's the best we can do for now.
echolalia, you state "Note that groups like AI and HRW have always documented a massive escalation in human rights abuses once Tiger areas are taken over by the government." Source from AI and HRW please.
You state 3 reasons for why the situation would improve in LTTE controlled areas. 1. Otherwise they would leave. Incorrect, they cannot leave due to pass system. Why would VP remove that if people started leaving? 2-3. "Tamils would be far less willing to accept such political repression, as the Tigers would no longer be able to blame it on a war against the SL government.""an independent Tamil state would in no way bring about an improvement in material livelihood for the mass of people." Dictators can ignore public opinion, see nations like Myanmar and North Korea.
I will repeat my points. Your are right, there may be problem with some of these rights in Sri Lanka. However, in VP's dictatorship there are no rights at all.
Sri Lanka - VP's dictatorship
Many parties - one party
Many government critical groups and newspapers - no critical voices allowed of any kind
Elected government - dictator who plans to make his son dictator after him
Volunteer army - Forced conscription with torture of deserters
Freedom of movement - Pass system prevent civilians from leaving a war zone
Freedom of assembly with lots of ant-government rallies etc - none allowed at all
For more info on the subject.
http://defencewire.blogspot.com/2008/03/mig-29.html
http://defencewire.blogspot.com/2008/02/coin-aircraft-alternative-to-mig29s.html
This was an article that appeared during this period on the Janes Defence Weekly. Perhaps you would believe it then.
"The Sri Lankan Air Force (SLAF) looks set to spend up to LKR 7,779.4 million (USD 69.6 million) on major capital equipment over the period july to December 2007 in anticipation of a major government offensive against northern strongholds of the LTTE. Sri Lanka is looking to bolster its military capabilities and the Air Forces’s share of this planned build up is worth nearly USD 300 million. – Jane’s Defence Weekly" http://jdw.janes.com/public/jdw/index.shtml
I would like to remind a notice to everyone here. That is not to fall into repeated reply sessions with diaspora. It is right that you make the points very clear to them and beat them [easy easy as they are sitting on their own tale most of the time].
But if you notice that they are going around the facts killing time and wasting blog space, do not reply. Reply only if they are replying to the point. Sadly they cant do it for long. They are tumbling over their own feat.
For an ex. Bahiravaya is still not replying the true facts in which I proved he's wrong. He can kill time. He's free to do that.
Join me in studying the maniac psychology. How the good doctors can support suicide bombers. How the Engineers can support bomb technicians. How the economists can support money laundering, how the traders can supprt smuggling etc etc.
Let us discuss how a bunch of maniacs satisfy their sadistic dreams by orchestrating genocide on the helpless bro/sis of their own race. And how they still attempt to say that when they jump to the train and get knocked it is the fault of the train not theirs.
Apino Dannachess said...
How do you know about the caste that populated in either side of Galle so much?
Any books/ records you can refer?
------------
Well, firstly I grew up with them. Half of my school frnds are descending from the ppl of my description. And I have lots of relatives among the group. Lastly my neighborhood is a mix [of old day castes] and they are a significant component.
Now pls dont take me for a castist, and I give no care for caste or race. Notably this brave-hearted group contribute heavily to SLDF and I always hear good stories about their bravery.
Balapitiya is known as hero's town, and you are greeted with a board with two swards crossed, when you enter the region. Rajgama is said to be the village of the kings. The kings of their own, the regional ones.
I am not sure whether they came from India. But every time when I hear the diff sinhala accent I felt that it is like sinhala spoken in the flow of hindi. Then I saw a paper article by a historian stating they are some brahman indian descent who came to SL very long ago. Since they settled around Galle they took little longer to get mixed with rest. They were good traders [until portugese came] and their political power was first noted by means of powerful minister Deva Pathiraja of king parakramabahu the second.
Well I hv no references at hand, sorry.
Hello Boys,
Edited my nickname to be more readable. Interesting to hear some of the history discussions.
Just like to remind that Eelam was declared in 1919. And that the Vellalars like Suntheralingam slept at the Temple entrance to stop the "low castes"from entering in 1969. They also had thugs assault the low-caste people doing stayagraha (Adida, Kabaragoya).
It does achieve little to attempt to have a debate or a conversation with those who are one eyed and believe in their own superiority. It does not matter how often we apologise for the acts of animals who called themselves Jathi Ale sinhala. They (the Peelamists) will never apologise for the acts of animals who call themselves Tigers. Instead they will call these "reprisals".
Any one try and find when the people called "tamil" were first formed as a distinct nation/ethnicity? You won't find any evidence of such a nation until the mid 1900's. If they want to insult themselves by calling themselves an insult hurled by Buddhists (Damilla) let them do so.
Dravidian was the alterego of Aryan, both being invented by the European race-theorists. Prominent among them was Bishop Caldwell who fantasised that the Europeans were related to the founders of the "superior" Sanskrit language whom the European named Aryan (mistaking the term Arya meaning noble- used by all Indians including Pandyas and Cholas). Caldwell fantasised that the "Aryans" invaded and subjugated the "Dasas" whom he called Dravidians (derived from an ancient writer Kumaradasa who called the people of the peninsula Dravida- literally people of the water- I presume)
It is very clear now that there is no such thing as race (other than human race). But note Aryan ~ Dravidian and Nazi ~ Tamil. Both believe in a master/pure race. Both identify another "race" to demonise and to obliterate (Jews vs. Sinhalas).Both groups are fascists (just visit tamilnation.org and read their propaganda and dreams of World domination via a Pan-Tamil nation).
Enough of a brief excerpt from history. Just to warn those who will be taken in by Dravidianist/Eelamist Tamil fascists. I used to believe that Jaffan people were gentle people (because my father told me so), until I read that they thought Sinhala women are sluts and men deamons and that all Jaffna Tamils were advised to speak gently to the sinhalas in case they lost control of their emotions (read Bryan Pfafenberger's analysis of the Vellalar).
A visiting racists POME bastard in the mid 19th century described the "Tamuls" as "cat like creatures who would develop an abiding affection for their masters if treated well". By contrast he hated the sinhalas who he described in terms of being vane and proud and unwilling to do any menial work for the "masters".
What we see today I guess is not much different. Attempting to treat people as brothers when they think quite disparagingly of us does appear foolish. Perhaps that is why they call us "Modayas".
Please don't get me wrong. I do not wish to label all Tamil speakers as having the qualities above or of being treacherous. Clearly this is not the case. But anyone who wants to divide the small island of Sri Lanka need to be seen in this light.
What psychological and propaganda strategies should be used? I have already outlined how they have already damaged themselves with their own lies. (Isn't Karma just the most beautiful thing?). I also suggested that the Indian and White Modayas should be further educated about their treacherous nature. Pursuing the dieasspora criminals through class action is a must.
I would like to suggest another tactic which may catch the Eelamists in SL and the Dravidianists in India completely off guard (that is until I've mentioned it here). Because of the false subscription to a non-existant "Tamil" race, they utterly hate anything regarded as not "Tamil". This applies to Hindi. I suggest that MR should make Hindi a compulsory language in the Sri Lankan curriculum. Learning the national language of India is likely to be an advantage for Sri Lankan kids who will take over the economy one day. (Besides, if you can speak their language, the more taste of Sitas for our Lankan boys). I am willing to bet my bottom dollar that the Dravidianists will come out of the woodwork protesting and doing Satyagrahas. The cat will really be out of the bag. On the other hand if they decide to not let the cat out of the bag, then they will have to eat humble pie as nauseated as they may be! (Hee Hee Hee). No better entertainment than a trapped Tiger. Besides, the fu*#@ng Indian polys who go on about "Tamil Genocide" will suddenly go "mum", I am sure.
Another strategy I would like to consider is that Sri Lanka should start producing as much defence material as possible within the island. An example would be producing material which would minimise the impact of bombing which escape intelligence.
1) Parcel Bombs in Public Transport: these appear to be set off by mobile phones or something similar. If you use a simple principle of physics- EM waves like Radio and Microwaves will fail to enter the interior of a metal mesh-cage. Should Sri Lanka adopt a strategy of enclosing all parcels/bags in public transport in wire cages of a certain gauge-mesh?
2)Suicide Bombers- It seems to me they always have some form of wire involved in their devices. I wonder if a simple, circular antenna like device could detect metal concealed under clothes without having to resort to buying elaborate devices from overseas? Surely, Sri lankan engineers could develop such devices (both hand-held and in security screens).
While the Tamil doctors, engineers, lawyers and economists think up the most destructive mechanisms to bring misery to Sri Lankan people (think of the accumulated Karma about to be visited upon them or their descendents) we can surely use the ingenuity of Sri Lankans to invent many defensive but cheap devices which could also create a n export market?
If any of the engineers on the forum think these ideas are not completely stupid and that I am not F.I.T.H. I may discretely forward such ideas to GR. Whoah! Now I am acting like one of our narcissistic Peelam brothers. I am sure GR has a good brains trust which advise hi appropriately.
http://www.tamileelamnews.com/news/publish/tns_10217.shtml
DW,
Are ya sure mate the Mig 29 deal was $500m ? Like GoldenEagle said !
I thought Mig deal was $70m ? And it's mentioned that the Migs have arrived ?
It's waste of money anyway, since it's not suited for Lanka.
Also, can ya comment on the Shopping list from Pakistan ?
TKX !
But, I like the post mate !
DW,
Are ya sure mate the Mig 29 deal was $500m ? Like GoldenEagle said !
I thought Mig deal was $70m ? And it's mentioned that the Migs have arrived ?
It's waste of money anyway, since it's not suited for Lanka.
Also, can ya comment on the Shopping list from Pakistan ?
TKX !
But, I like the post mate !
Each spanking shiny new Mig29 was to cost us US$ 15million, totalling USD75Million for 5 units.
Looks like the govt found its common sense, particularly now that the F7 can do the job relatively much cheaper and does not involve a learning curve.
The Mig29 was known to have been a pet project of the present SLAF commander, who had pushed hard for it. Sorry Roshan, go play with your other toys.
Good job, SLG!
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